Playing against amateurs

[telespf]

If you have a good play, because you have good strategys a you play a severeal time, soon you a good player.

If you receveid a convit to play CASH GAME with yours friends, and this friends is a amateurs players.

What your strategy against several gamers amateurs in the table, you exchange your modal game? You play more conservate? You keep the aressive? You play more agressive?

I am having difficult, because my frindes love see the floop, and normaly, we have 4 or five plyers in the hand. Yet I cant found the valaue that my friends folding before flop.

I aready tried 3, 5 and 8 BB before flop, and every time we have many opponents.

 

[Ace of Spad3s]

Tighten up in that game, playing multiway pots is only a good thing with strong holdings. Don't raise up with speculative hands preflop.

Maybe consider a limping strategy to see cheaper flops and take it from there.

 

[Huntre]

on the other hand it's your friends, enjoy company and put it slow, and if pre-flop aggression isn't working i will agree with @Ace of Spad3s, keep it tighten.

 

[telespf]

Aperte nesse jogo, jogar potes multiway só é uma coisa boa com mãos fortes. Não aumente com mãos especulativas pré-flop.

Talvez considere uma estratégia de limp para ver flops mais baratos e partir daí.

What strategy would you recommend for this case?

I've been trying to reduce the range, but many already complain that I never play.....


What would be the least harmful type of range and bet size in the long run? In any case, we have to have fun, without losing .... hauahuah

 

[Viparida]

the book play on these cases is to be tight but there are always spots to be more aggressive even against amateurs

 

[Canaldo Kao]

If you have a good play, because you have good strategys a you play a severeal time, soon you a good player.

If you receveid a convit to play CASH GAME with yours friends, and this friends is a amateurs players.

What your strategy against several gamers amateurs in the table, you exchange your modal game? You play more conservate? You keep the aressive? You play more agressive?

I am having difficult, because my frindes love see the floop, and normaly, we have 4 or five plyers in the hand. Yet I cant found the valaue that my friends folding before flop.

I aready tried 3, 5 and 8 BB before flop, and every time we have many opponents.

In amateur games, even more so in cash games, in my opinion, you always have to play seriously, if you have a competitive instinct, even against people who don't have much experience, you have to take it seriously!

 

[S3mper]

What strategy would you recommend for this case?

I've been trying to reduce the range, but many already complain that I never play.....


What would be the least harmful type of range and bet size in the long run? In any case, we have to have fun, without losing .... hauahuah

If the game doesn't have a rake you can actually play a bit looser especially if you believe yourself to have an edge over the opponents. And as you allude to even though there might be more EV to be gained playing tighter that edge is irrelevant if you're not getting invited back.

I'd recommend checking out opening charts and then if you're running card dead add a few hands to account for the no rake.

Another thing you can do to bring more action for fun is run some flips/races. Even though these are pure gambles, they're statistically break even plays so you can add more fun without sacrificing EV. Obviously, this increases variance but it might help with the nit image.

Edit: And bring the beer

 

[Ace of Spad3s]

What strategy would you recommend for this case?

I've been trying to reduce the range, but many already complain that I never play.....


What would be the least harmful type of range and bet size in the long run? In any case, we have to have fun, without losing .... hauahuah

Well, if your goal is to win consistently you should player stronger hands instead of speculative hands. Raising a wide range preflop will only lead to bleeding your stack quickly, while raising with stronger hands gives you an edge postflop.
Or consider limping more often, cheaper flops and the multiway pots might lead to bigger wins if you do connect with the flop.

But like Huntre said, they are your friends, maybe consider that to be a good night with friends and just play for fun instead of aiming for max EV, as it's not always fun to do so (unless you're playing for serious money, obviously).

With friends I'll just play for a few bucks or winner gets a crate of beer or something. Then you put fun first, winning just gets you bragging rights, losing cost nothing.

 

[lauestla]

If you have a good play, because you have good strategys a you play a severeal time, soon you a good player.

If you receveid a convit to play CASH GAME with yours friends, and this friends is a amateurs players.

What your strategy against several gamers amateurs in the table, you exchange your modal game? You play more conservate? You keep the aressive? You play more agressive?

I am having difficult, because my frindes love see the floop, and normaly, we have 4 or five plyers in the hand. Yet I cant found the valaue that my friends folding before flop.

I aready tried 3, 5 and 8 BB before flop, and every time we have many opponents.

I have exactly the same experience when playing cash game with friends. Even if I am dealt a monster like QQ or KK, my raise pre flop is called by at least 2 players and one of them often hits a straight or a flush.
So it's very tough to play.
The only solution is to limp... and to pray.
Bug it's not poker IMO

 

[pentazepam]

I am having difficult, because my frindes love see the floop, and normaly, we have 4 or five plyers in the hand. Yet I cant found the valaue that my friends folding before flop.

I aready tried 3, 5 and 8 BB before flop, and every time we have many opponents.

What a total dream game. If you don't feel bad winning from friends - thank your lucky star.

I have written it a lot of times: You WANT them to call with a lot of hands Pre-flop!

If they fold their trash hands you certainly win less money in the long run.

The secret (if the stacks are reasonably deep), especially if a lot of players call your raises, is to play hands that have the potential to make the nuts: Pocket pairs Especially 77 and over, Suited Aces and Suited Kings, and High to Medium Suited Connectors.

Be careful if you "only" flop top pair or an over-pair if deep and multiway.

Maybe you don't win as many hands as you do when you can isolate an opponent (or fold out their equity).

BUT when you hit a set (especially top set), the nut (or a high) flush, or the nut straight you will win massive pots.

The games you describe are fantastic games that remind me of the early days of online poker. That time has passed and it will never be that easy to win money online again.


If you don't believe me do a search for something like: "hands that go up in value multiway flop in nlh" on google or youtube.

 

[takinitSLEAZEE]

I think when it comes to amateurs, or non-pros as I refer to them, it's going to be a "show-n-tell" scenario. In other words, you're going to have to prove it to them. Show them the error of their ways by making them pay for it. I had to do it where I go play, except it was the other way around. I don't get pushed around as much anymore, thanx CC.
I know this, amateurs do not like 3 bets and being put all-in on the flop. Actually, no player does, lol. To us it's just a move but amateurs tend to get a little tilty afterwards, especially after you show a 53o. They can be easily picked off by this time.
Remember, you don't want to be the bad doctor and have no patience... I know it's patients but it's only grammar. Show them you're the pro by using patience, hand selection, and well-timed bluffs to your advantage. You know, play poker. GL man.

 

[machinm19]

Tight is right IMO for this situation. Most people won't fold much at home games so playing only strong hands is a big advantage.

 

[LaNimmer]

Every now and then I join a bunch of guys for a night of cash game $1 $2 with a mandatory$4 straddle (only one though). The problem is that they all have bottomless wallets and they are all maniacs! Position means nothing, strategic betting is not effective as they often go all in without looking at their cards. Raising and reraising has no effect. And it is always a community pot. There is no chance of putting anybody on a range or following the betting patterns. I cannot read physical tells as there is so much good cheer going around and nobody is concerned about winning or loosing or bluffing. So I sit there and play so tight and wait for AA or KK, nothing less has much chance. Some nights I make a pile and some I'm just plain cold. In the end they serve a fine lunch, lots of snacks, free top notch booze and it's always entertaining. My wife has fits when she knows I am going over there! LOL.

 

[JTifenbah]

You cannot change anything at their game play. You can only adopt to them, and play more passive. Dont raise your good hands, just try to limp it more often and play like "station" (check/call). On those games, is pointless to protect your range and holdings, because they often chase godshots and sets, 2 pairs. When you play premium hands, try to squeze preflop and jam on any good flops. Its the only way to protect your hand

 

[Gallarado777]

If you play with friends and you know that they love watching the flop, then open the flop with a very aggressive bet so that when they can't leave the flop and go all the way, you need to play a strong hand and you'll lure them to the flop because they love to watch 3 maps so I think they'll pay even more so you have information on them

 

[smerald]

I play with some friends who are also amateurs that love to see flops. My advice for better play would be to play it straight up. Don’t play too many hands except for those that play well with multiple players in the pot like suited connectors and play your premium hands strong since they’ll be coming along but you’ll be the odds on favorite to win.

However, keep in mind you’re also there to have a good time with your friends. I won a few too many times in a row in our games which almost discouraged further games. So I started to donk it out from time to time to give others an opportunity to win too and improve the vibes.

 

[Fepitaph]

yes, it will sound stupid, but just play an exploit, if it’s more specific, then if you understand that you rarely hit the board with aj-ak, then let’s 3bb, and easily stretch the flop, fold turn, because the pot will not be dispersed and you will be it’s easier to part with a hand, with conkctors, of any variations (78, qj, kq etc) let’s use large isolates, because you will hit the board often and you can collect good value, even if you get paid only two streets,

 

[TeUnit]

You also really want to have position in these multi-way hands.

Another thing to look at is which players will fold to cbets, raise them small and raise the more stationy players larger with value.

 

[dimon4ik89]

If we gather with friends at someone’s house to play poker, then this is friendly poker, there is no aggression in it and no one sets a goal to earn money, we all enjoy the game and have fun. But if we are talking about playing in a poker club or casino, then my attitude to the game is completely different, even if all my friends are at the poker table, in this case we still play real poker and we are each other’s rivals. Choosing a suitable raise before the flop is not very difficult, if your friends call 8bb, then raise more. Learn to adapt to the table and your opponents, even if they are your friends.

 

[pentazepam]

As I have written before many times on this forum: multiway pots are a fantastic opportunity to earn a lot of money. You don't tighten up in this type of game to the point where you only play the absolute premium hands - especially not if your opponents not only play a lot of trash but also overvalue top pair and other medium holdings.

Position goes up in importance of course since you do want to either see a lot of speculative hands cheap or re-raise your premiums big.

In late position, you can open up more in your average tight game. Play every Pair, Suited Connector (and even unsuited connectors especially Broadway), all Axs, All Kxs, All Qxs to a limp, or a single raise with several callers.

If you hit the nuts or close to it you will be paid of a lot more than if the game was tight.

So don't tighten up too much. Play speculative hands that can hit really big. The only things you should be a little more careful with (if you can't isolate to one or two players) are the unsuited Aces and Unsuited Broadways since top pair hands are more likely not to be good in multiway pots. And if you don't hit a set be careful with Overpairs and do some pot control and fold more often if someone raises on the turn or the river.

 

[Pokerpoet2]

I was once invited by my son in law to go around to his house and help teach a few of his Friends how Tournament Poker is played, As I was a Taxi Driver Saturday nights were off the table, so I agreed to go up on a Friday night and I was not afraid of losing too much in takings as it was the last Friday before the monthly pay packets for most came out.
I ran the game like I would any Poker tournament with blinds going up every 20 minutes and we all enjoyed the night, afterwards we started playing other card games like Chase the Ace and blackjack and we called it a night around 2.00 am.
The next night I was working and having a chat with one of my Friends on the Taxi Rank, I asked how the previous night was, if it was quiet or busy and he said it was dead! Only making about £30.00 off the rank after midnight. "Oh!" I said, "I made £60.00" "But I thought you were having a night off playing Poker" he replied, "I did and it paid off, It was like taking Candy from Babies" I replied.
I not only won the Poker Tournament I was also cashing in at the other games we played.
Amateurs, I love them.

 

[Acechador]

Well, it seems that you're not different from your novice friends... I would let them gain confidence from one hand to another and I would pressure them to make mistakes when I have good hands and the flop benefits me. Rather than using BB I would use psychological strategy.

 

[choprav]

Raise big with good hands, limp a bit and just crush them when you hit. Chr k the flops to see if they hit something

 

[LUKADONCICMVP]

tight is right, ask phil hellmuth about it

 

[dreamer13]

There is always a luck factor in poker. Absolutely anyone can win in the short term, and that’s normal. If amateurs always lost, they wouldn’t be left in poker at all, because what’s the point of playing at a constant disadvantage?