Limping only strategy in a short stack tournament

[miklcct]

I tried using a limp-only strategy in a short stack bounty tournament with an entry fee of €1 (in which €0.50 goes to the bounty) and a starting stack of 10 BB, and I ended up winning money at the 5th place (I once reached the 2nd by winning a few post flop plays, but lost a large portion afterwards in a 50% flip trying to take down a bounty).

I limped both premium hands (including AA) and speculative hands which play well post-flop (e.g. suited connectors) but was cautious with things like Ax or Kx, preferring to fold them at an early position because it would cause me problems with a lot of flops, not sure if I would continue or not against a very. I increased the stack fast when the flop hit when villains called my 25% raises, and if I could get to see the flop cheap, I fold immediately when it didn't hit.

If I got raised after limping, I would then fold, call or shove depending on my two cards and the villain's stack, however, most of the hands I could see the flop cheap.

Is the above limp-only actually a valid strategy in short-stacked tournament play so that I can prolong my tournament life and avoid flips?

 

[Flyer35]

"Limping only" is virtually never a good strategy. In fact it's not a strategy at all.

 

[sibkaz]

Poker requires constant adaptation and variety in the choice of play lines in order to remain in a winning position and make the game unpredictable for other players.

 

[Baco]

I tried using a limp-only strategy in a short stack bounty tournament with an entry fee of €1 (in which €0.50 goes to the bounty) and a starting stack of 10 BB, and I ended up winning money at the 5th place (I once reached the 2nd by winning a few post flop plays, but lost a large portion afterwards in a 50% flip trying to take down a bounty).

I limped both premium hands (including AA) and speculative hands which play well post-flop (e.g. suited connectors) but was cautious with things like Ax or Kx, preferring to fold them at an early position because it would cause me problems with a lot of flops, not sure if I would continue or not against a very. I increased the stack fast when the flop hit when villains called my 25% raises, and if I could get to see the flop cheap, I fold immediately when it didn't hit.

If I got raised after limping, I would then fold, call or shove depending on my two cards and the villain's stack, however, most of the hands I could see the flop cheap.

Is the above limp-only actually a valid strategy in short-stacked tournament play so that I can prolong my tournament life and avoid flips?

i dont like limp strategy

 

[puzzlefish]

The strategy works if the rest of the table doesn't limp with you.

 

[fundiver199]

In general you only want to limp from SB or occationally limp behind other limpers. 10BB is an excellent stack size to open push and try to steal the blinds. A tournament with a starting stack of just 10BB is a pretty poor format, so dont play these to often.

 

[MK_]

No.

 

[miklcct]

The strategy works if the rest of the table doesn't limp with you.

What is the problem when the rest of the table limp with me? I hoped that others limped as well so I could extract value in post flop play.

 

[LuTsu]

Nice experiment and congrats on the cash.
In general though, with ~10 BB, a limp only approach isn’t great long term.
You lose fold equity and let opponents realize their equity too easily.
Avoiding flips feels good, but in bounty tournaments some flips are actually +EV.

Selective limping can work in soft games, but as a default, push or fold tends to do better.

 

[miklcct]

Nice experiment and congrats on the cash.
In general though, with ~10 BB, a limp only approach isn’t great long term.
You lose fold equity and let opponents realize their equity too easily.
Avoiding flips feels good, but in bounty tournaments some flips are actually +EV.

Selective limping can work in soft games, but as a default, push or fold tends to do better.

I still don't understand how a push / fold strategy is better because one losing push means you are out of the tournament, and you have to be incredibly lucky to survive multiple 70% flips, compared to a strategy where you aim to survive into the bubble.

A lot of people even open-shove with 92o and when I call with AKo, of course it is +Chip EV but I am not even sure if this act is +Tournament EV for us when it means that one of us will be killed whenever there is a flip, while some the ICM value will be distributed to those who fold.

 

[WrongUsername]

good luck with your strategy, i raise or 3b only

 

[puzzlefish]

What is the problem when the rest of the table limp with me? I hoped that others limped as well so I could extract value in post flop play.

Your equity goes down as all sorts of hands end up seeing the flop.

 

[MK_]

I still don't understand how a push / fold strategy is better because one losing push means you are out of the tournament, and you have to be incredibly lucky to survive multiple 70% flips, compared to a strategy where you aim to survive into the bubble.

A lot of people even open-shove with 92o and when I call with AKo, of course it is +Chip EV but I am not even sure if this act is +Tournament EV for us when it means that one of us will be killed whenever there is a flip, while some the ICM value will be distributed to those who fold.

A 70% hand is not a flip...,

AKo v 92o is a 67% hand... again not a flip,

if you hold 2 unpaired cards the odds of making a pair on the flop is 29%,

one losing push doesn't mean you're out unless you're the short stack,

poker is a game of odds..., playing against the odds is a losing strategy long term,

especially in a short stack bounty game, but carry on👍

 

[miklcct]

I tried the same again today but this time I didn't make it to the bubble. I got back €0.75 in bounties though with my €1 buy-in so it was only a small loss. I more than doubled my stack in the first hand by limp-calling with AQo, resulting in a multi-way bloasted pot when an A appeared in the flop, and soon afterwards I 4-bet shoved with QQ (I was at a late position and the betting already got 3-bet to me) and won another big pot.

However, I lost my winning afterwards mainly in two big hands:
1. I called a short stack shove with A5o but another villain with long stack also called, and the flop went 326. The villain shoved at the flop and I was forced to fold.
2. I was at the UTG at a 4-player table with the shortest stack and open-limped with ATo, CO raised to 2BB (folded after BB raised), BB raised to 6.3 BB and I called. The flop went 36A and BB shoved out-of-position. I could only fold because AJ, AQ, AK and AA formed the majority of the range given such pre-flop action. I shouldn't have called the 3-bet exactly because of this reason.

 

[TeUnit]

They invented fold equity for a reason.

 

[dreamer13]

You can't afford to limp and then just give up on the flop if you miss the board. You have to strive to be aggressive at all times, because that's how you win in poker.Avoid small pairs, suited connectors, and weak aces.With a short stack, you don't necessarily need to wait for a monster hand like two pair or a flush to go all-in. The thing is, you simply won't be dealt those hands often enough, and the blinds will simply eat up your stack. So you need to be prepared to push with something else. And the best candidates for this role are drawing hands.

 

[TheniT]

Limping is rarely a good strategy; if you have few chips, going all in is, in my opinion, much more profitable.

 

[Rosylly]

So you limped, and then what? Half of the table limped too and you miss flop? Or somebody raising you and fold?

Ofc limping with AA can work sometimes, but in a long term it’s far from great

 

[Mantinhoo]

With ~10 BB, a limp-only strategy is generally suboptimal. You give up fold equity, let opponents see cheap flops, and miss +EV shove spots. Avoiding flips may prolong survival short-term, but it usually hurts long-term EV, especially in bounty tournaments. Limping can work occasionally, but shouldn’t be your main strategy.

 

[miklcct]

So you limped, and then what? Half of the table limped too and you miss flop? Or somebody raising you and fold?

Ofc limping with AA can work sometimes, but in a long term it’s far from great

Yes, if I didn't hit and someone bet I would fold, but in a lot of hands everyone checked all the way to a free river.

 

[CDNMAN 42]

I tried using a limp-only strategy in a short stack bounty tournament with an entry fee of €1 (in which €0.50 goes to the bounty) and a starting stack of 10 BB, and I ended up winning money at the 5th place (I once reached the 2nd by winning a few post flop plays, but lost a large portion afterwards in a 50% flip trying to take down a bounty).

I limped both premium hands (including AA) and speculative hands which play well post-flop (e.g. suited connectors) but was cautious with things like Ax or Kx, preferring to fold them at an early position because it would cause me problems with a lot of flops, not sure if I would continue or not against a very. I increased the stack fast when the flop hit when villains called my 25% raises, and if I could get to see the flop cheap, I fold immediately when it didn't hit.

If I got raised after limping, I would then fold, call or shove depending on my two cards and the villain's stack, however, most of the hands I could see the flop cheap.

Is the above limp-only actually a valid strategy in short-stacked tournament play so that I can prolong my tournament life and avoid flips?

While limping certainly disguises the possible value of your holding it also gives some players a free ride, i.e. the BB gets in no matter their cards and fairly regularly in on line MTTs the BB scores a bad beat with garbage that catches and then the holder of AA etc whines about the rigging of the cards...As once said by Kid Poker. "Limping is Pimping"

 

[WrongUsername]

i never like limping unless against complete maniacs ont table

 

[Alpha737]

Short answer: it can work at €1 stakes, but it’s not optimal.
A limp-only strategy with 10 BB can exploit passive players and avoid variance, which is why you cashed. But you give up fold equity, cap your range, and miss profitable shove spots—especially important in bounty tournaments.
Use limping as an exploit, not a default. Long term, a push-fold + selective limps approach will win more.

 

[wushibala]

Every strategy has its pros and cons, and if you’ve made it this far in the tournament, it doesn’t mean it will always work. Limping with AA can backfire though))) because not everyone can fold in time later on.