Ask BlackRain79 Anything About Cash Games

TPC · Nov 14, 2019

Thank you for doing this! Very awesome of you to do. Could you tell us what your BRM strategies are? Thanks in advance!

lkmolina · Nov 15, 2019

what do you think about pokerstars limiting multitabling to 4 tables? do you think that this will change somehow the way people play? A little more loose perhaps?
Thanks

TheGenera1 · Nov 15, 2019

Hi Nathan,

I watch all your youtube videos and have read your first book. I have a rather specific question. I was wondering if you would be kind enough to post some of your longest break even stretches / downswings at the small stakes. It would be really nice for me to see them just so I can say "hey, BlackRain has downswings too, even at the small stakes"

Also, do you still play often, or is poker just not that fun for you any more and live off your poker site revenues?

Many thanks.

Shells · Nov 15, 2019

It's great to have you aboard, Nathan! I will be watching the thread with interest!

azforlife · Nov 15, 2019

Hi Nate the great,this is really awesome! I've read your answers thus far & they've all been genuine & down to earth.
My question would be how do you stay disciplined with regard to BRM say if you've got a goal & you hit a downswing taking shots (this is a mind state question I guess).. & more specifically for e.g how many bb should I buy in with, how many buyins for a day (if you use a stop-loss)? I've started experimenting with 40bb its perfect if you've got a small bankroll & wanna move up.
Would be nice to hear your experiences throughout the years with regards to downswings, BRM, discipline, travel rake [emoji51][emoji106][emoji120][emoji847][emoji847][emoji847]

Shadyginzo · Nov 15, 2019

Samples

Hi Nathan,

Always keep up with your channel, you always give a straightforward, truthful take on the micros.

I've started trying to work my way up the stakes and see where that gets me. Luckily I hit a "rhythm" with NL2 early on and posted 11bb/100 over a 10000 sample size. Had a bit of confidence and moved to NL5 where I've posted 7.5bb/100 over another 10k sample.

Now I know those samples could be bigger, which is my question.

If I'm trying to move up how long would you wait to "prove" to yourself that you can beat a given stake?

Thanks in advance and thanks for doing this!

SG

nabmom · Nov 15, 2019

Nice to see you being even more active on our forum. I totally agree that this is the forum that pays off its members in so many ways.

Thank you for taking time to be here and respond to our questions.

I'm a big fan of your videos and satisfied consumer of Crushing the Microstakes (and the study group that this forum created with it a few years back). For 2019/2020, are there things about that book that you would change?

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

TPC said:
Thank you for doing this! Very awesome of you to do. Could you tell us what your BRM strategies are? Thanks in advance!

Hey TPC,

No worries happy to help!

With BRM I tend to use a pretty conservative approach. And this is because I have relied on poker for all or part of my income for a long time. I don't want to ever go broke!

So I typically have like at least 100 buy-ins for any cash game I am playing in. Now, I will say that this is way overkill though for most amateur players. I think that anywhere above 30 buy-ins will be fine.

I am not really an expert on tournament BRM but I would say that 100 buy-ins is probably the minimum recommended for amateurs. This is because the variance (swings, ups and downs) are a lot more pronounced in tourneys than in cash games.

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

lkmolina said:
what do you think about pokerstars limiting multitabling to 4 tables? do you think that this will change somehow the way people play? A little more loose perhaps?
Thanks

Hey lkmolina,

This is something that I have been asked about a lot. A big part of my poker career was spent 24 tabling on Pokerstars, so this was as big of a shock to me as anyone!

Now with that said, one thing I have learned throughout the years in this game is that you have to learn to roll with the punches and the ever changing poker environment. The days of mass multi-tabling on Pokerstars are over and so we have to adjust.

For me, I already stopped doing this many years ago though because I need to table select more in today's games and make higher quality decisions. When I am playing 20+ tables, I can't do these things. I could get away with it in the past but not in today's tougher games.

So I think that the people that want to continue playing a lot of hands will perhaps play more Zoom or play on other poker sites. I think the games might loosen up a bit as well like you suggest.

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

TheGenera1 said:
Hi Nathan,

I watch all your youtube videos and have read your first book. I have a rather specific question. I was wondering if you would be kind enough to post some of your longest break even stretches / downswings at the small stakes. It would be really nice for me to see them just so I can say "hey, BlackRain has downswings too, even at the small stakes"

Also, do you still play often, or is poker just not that fun for you any more and live off your poker site revenues?

Many thanks.

Hey TheGenera1

Thanks for being a big supporter of my work!

Oh man, I have had some brutal ones. I have touched on this in a few articles on my website before. I have almost quit poker so many times over the years because I hit the downswing from hell.

I have gone months without posting any kind of profit many times throughout my poker career and in terms of hands, I have gone through 100k+ without winning.

This is why I say all the time that I believe 100k hands is a bare minimum to draw any conclusions about your poker results.

People think I am crazy and I understand that many people do not even play 100k hands in a year. But I know for a fact that you can run significantly below EV (expected value) even over stretches of hands this long.

I still play poker as much as I can. I consider myself semi-pro now. But my poker website and youtube channel alone are a full time job now.

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

Shells said:
It's great to have you aboard, Nathan! I will be watching the thread with interest!

Thanks Shells I am happy to be here!

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

azforlife said:
Hi Nate the great,this is really awesome! I've read your answers thus far & they've all been genuine & down to earth.
My question would be how do you stay disciplined with regard to BRM say if you've got a goal & you hit a downswing taking shots (this is a mind state question I guess).. & more specifically for e.g how many bb should I buy in with, how many buyins for a day (if you use a stop-loss)? I've started experimenting with 40bb its perfect if you've got a small bankroll & wanna move up.
Would be nice to hear your experiences throughout the years with regards to downswings, BRM, discipline, travel rake [emoji51][emoji106][emoji120][emoji847][emoji847][emoji847]

Thanks for the kind words azforlife!

I think the thing to always remember with BRM (bankroll management for those reading this that don't know), is that even the best players in the world regularly have to move down.

Because when you are taking a shot, there is always a large element of short term luck involved. Even if you found a really good game against some rec players where you have a large edge, if they cooler you in a couple big hands (KK into AA etc.), that's it for you and you need to move back down.

So with regards to being disciplined with taking shots, I think the best thing to remember is that it is about moving both up and down. Most people just focus on the up part. You should be prepared to fail again and again when taking shots in poker.

With regards to what amount to buy-in for, I already touched on that a bit above in another question, but I have always been a full stack player, 100bb. This doesn't mean that I think buying in short can't work for some people in some situations, it's just not my area of expertise.

Although I did actually even write a big article on that lol. My guide to optimal 50bb poker strategy:

https://www.blackrain79.com/2017/11/50bb-poker-strategy.html

I always recommend for people to learn full stack at some point at least though because if your aim is to be the best player at the table each time you sit down to play, then this is how you are going to exercise your edge to the fullest.

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

Shadyginzo said:
Hi Nathan,

Always keep up with your channel, you always give a straightforward, truthful take on the micros.

I've started trying to work my way up the stakes and see where that gets me. Luckily I hit a "rhythm" with NL2 early on and posted 11bb/100 over a 10000 sample size. Had a bit of confidence and moved to NL5 where I've posted 7.5bb/100 over another 10k sample.

Now I know those samples could be bigger, which is my question.

If I'm trying to move up how long would you wait to "prove" to yourself that you can beat a given stake?

Thanks in advance and thanks for doing this!

SG

Hey SG,

Thanks for following my work! Great results also by the way.

This is a bit of a tough question because variance can be so crazy in poker. I usually say 20k hands to draw a few conclusions, 50k to be fairly certain and 100k to be highly certain.

Now with all that said, for somebody like you who smashes NL2 for 11bb/100 over a still reasonable sample of 10k hands, I don't think there is any reason why you shouldn't move up.

Because depending on your goals in this game, there is a lot of opportunity cost of playing a huge number of hands at a certain limit just to prove to yourself that you can beat it.

I would say that if you are having big success over say a minimum sample of 10k hands like you did, then you should take a shot at the next limit. Worst thing that happens is you fail (which will happen a lot no matter what you do, like I just talked about above in another reply), and you move back down for awhile.

You also always learn a lot from your move up attempts. Many of my failed shots at playing higher stakes have actually been my greatest learning experiences. Especially if I feel like I got outplayed.

Hope this helps.

Nathan Williams · Nov 15, 2019

nabmom said:
Nice to see you being even more active on our forum. I totally agree that this is the forum that pays off its members in so many ways.

Thank you for taking time to be here and respond to our questions.

I'm a big fan of your videos and satisfied consumer of Crushing the Microstakes (and the study group that this forum created with it a few years back). For 2019/2020, are there things about that book that you would change?

Thanks nabmom for the kind words and I am glad that Crushing the Microstakes and the videos helped you!

I think limping in early position with small pocket pairs is something that has been talked about a lot in the book. I did edit that section several years ago. I don't recommend limping at all anymore in these games.

The preflop over-raising as well haha. But I am pretty sure I also edited that section several years ago. I don't recommend using these over-raises in most cases anymore at NL2.

Other than that, I think the vast majority of the strategies in the book are still effective in the lower stakes games today. Because I primarily wrote this book to discuss how to play against bad players, recs. And the strategies to beat them I feel are evergreen, they never change.

What I would actually add to the book though if I were to re-write it today, is more strategy discussion of Zoom style fast fold games.

For example, I advocate a lot more bluffing against the regulars in these games because they have less information/reads on you and I think you get more respect.

However, there is a Zoom poker strategy bonus guide that now comes with the book and I have written about this extensively on my website as well in various articles.

TheGenera1 · Nov 16, 2019

Nathan Williams said:
Hey TheGenera1

Thanks for being a big supporter of my work!

Oh man, I have had some brutal ones. I have touched on this in a few articles on my website before. I have almost quit poker so many times over the years because I hit the downswing from hell.

I have gone months without posting any kind of profit many times throughout my poker career and in terms of hands, I have gone through 100k+ without winning.

This is why I say all the time that I believe 100k hands is a bare minimum to draw any conclusions about your poker results.

People think I am crazy and I understand that many people do not even play 100k hands in a year. But I know for a fact that you can run significantly below EV (expected value) even over stretches of hands this long.

I still play poker as much as I can. I consider myself semi-pro now. But my poker website and youtube channel alone are a full time job now.

You're welcome, I really enjoy your work and it has definitely helped me over the years.

Thanks for answering my questions

It's nice to hear you suffer from the same downswings and have almost quit. I know I've come close many times too.

Shadyginzo · Nov 16, 2019

Nathan Williams said:
Hey SG,

Thanks for following my work! Great results also by the way.

This is a bit of a tough question because variance can be so crazy in poker. I usually say 20k hands to draw a few conclusions, 50k to be fairly certain and 100k to be highly certain.

Now with all that said, for somebody like you who smashes NL2 for 11bb/100 over a still reasonable sample of 10k hands, I don't think there is any reason why you shouldn't move up.

Because depending on your goals in this game, there is a lot of opportunity cost of playing a huge number of hands at a certain limit just to prove to yourself that you can beat it.

I would say that if you are having big success over say a minimum sample of 10k hands like you did, then you should take a shot at the next limit. Worst thing that happens is you fail (which will happen a lot no matter what you do, like I just talked about above in another reply), and you move back down for awhile.

You also always learn a lot from your move up attempts. Many of my failed shots at playing higher stakes have actually been my greatest learning experiences. Especially if I feel like I got outplayed.

Hope this helps.

Thanks Nathan! I'll take that on board. Might give the NL5 a bit longer as it's been more volatile, but if I can maintain those results over another 10000 hands I'll take a shot at NL10.

Great speaking to you

SG

Dimitris · Nov 17, 2019

Hi Nathan

Is GTO poker the new ABC poker?

ABC poker you play your hand not the opponent.
GTO poker you just play your range correct?

Nathan Williams · Nov 18, 2019

Dimitris said:
Hi Nathan

Is GTO poker the new ABC poker?

ABC poker you play your hand not the opponent.
GTO poker you just play your range correct?

Hey Dimitris,

GTO poker is a big trend in the poker community over the past couple years. But I think it is actually doing a lot more harm than good for most low stakes poker players.

I will actually have a big article about this coming out on my website next month that will probably cause a huge stir in the poker community and get me some new haters as well

But essentially you are correct, ABC poker is just playing your cards and GTO is about trying to find mathematically correct frequencies for all your decisions (including how to construct your range).

I advocate a style of play for the lower stakes that is perhaps somewhere in the middle of both of these. It is often called "exploitative strategy" these days. Some people also call it "playing the player."

This is the optimal strategy to beat small stakes poker games for the highest winrate possible in my opinion.

Dimitris · Nov 18, 2019

Thank you for the time you spent to answer my question. I am waiting for your article.

YKCaiTLH1314 · Nov 18, 2019

Nathan Williams said:
I advocate a style of play for the lower stakes that is perhaps somewhere in the middle of both of these. It is often called "exploitative strategy" these days. Some people also call it "playing the player."

Hi Nat,

Many Pros and Coaches, including you, teach about not to open limb. It means weakness and also not maximizing your win on that hand.
I actually limb it purposely on EP knowing that someone will at least min raise me behind. My objective is to 3bet on min raise or shove all in on anything that is raise 5x and above.
Oh and i do this only when i'm having QQ+.
Sometimes i got no raiser which allow the SB & BB get to see the cheap flop, but it's like 80% of the time i get a raise behind.

Am i doing it right to open limb on this occasion?

azforlife · Nov 19, 2019

Nathan Williams said:
Thanks for the kind words azforlife!

I think the thing to always remember with BRM (bankroll management for those reading this that don't know), is that even the best players in the world regularly have to move down.

Because when you are taking a shot, there is always a large element of short term luck involved. Even if you found a really good game against some rec players where you have a large edge, if they cooler you in a couple big hands (KK into AA etc.), that's it for you and you need to move back down.

So with regards to being disciplined with taking shots, I think the best thing to remember is that it is about moving both up and down. Most people just focus on the up part. You should be prepared to fail again and again when taking shots in poker.

With regards to what amount to buy-in for, I already touched on that a bit above in another question, but I have always been a full stack player, 100bb. This doesn't mean that I think buying in short can't work for some people in some situations, it's just not my area of expertise.

Although I did actually even write a big article on that lol. My guide to optimal 50bb poker strategy:

https://www.blackrain79.com/2017/11/50bb-poker-strategy.html

I always recommend for people to learn full stack at some point at least though because if your aim is to be the best player at the table each time you sit down to play, then this is how you are going to exercise your edge to the fullest.

Hey Nate,
Yeah the idea of moving down after losing is a big leak of mine. Chronic sufferer of chasing losses but it's definitely something I need to start doing once it happens to make a habit of it. It's so easy to be undisciplined in a field where emotions run high & you're on your own the whole time. It's definitely something I've been thinking about, so thanks for confirming my concerns

With regards to buyins & BB, I'd ideally like to buy in for max as well but I put myself in a situation where I'm never rolled for what I'm about to play. So I agree & will drop this strategy once I'm fully rolled & focus on beating a level squarely like say NL10 & move on NL 20 & so forth.
Appreciate the tips & insight, thanks bro!

Talden · Nov 19, 2019

Hey Nathan, thanks for doing this. Ya CC really is a great place to learn and share at. And with the additions of the AMA threads it really is helpful. I am a subscriber at your site as well. Looking forward to more articles and answers. Peace.

Nathan Williams · Nov 19, 2019

YKCaiTLH1314 said:
Hi Nat,

Many Pros and Coaches, including you, teach about not to open limb. It means weakness and also not maximizing your win on that hand.
I actually limb it purposely on EP knowing that someone will at least min raise me behind. My objective is to 3bet on min raise or shove all in on anything that is raise 5x and above.
Oh and i do this only when i'm having QQ+.
Sometimes i got no raiser which allow the SB & BB get to see the cheap flop, but it's like 80% of the time i get a raise behind.

Am i doing it right to open limb on this occasion?

Hey YK,

The old limp/re-raise strategy definitely can still work well in some games. It is important to know who is at your table if you want to try this. Ideally you want to have multiple loose and aggressive players left to act.

Overall though, since you rarely see tables like this at the lower stakes, I think the standard play of raising preflop with your big hands will be more profitable over the long run.

Nathan Williams · Nov 19, 2019

azforlife said:
Hey Nate,
Yeah the idea of moving down after losing is a big leak of mine. Chronic sufferer of chasing losses but it's definitely something I need to start doing once it happens to make a habit of it. It's so easy to be undisciplined in a field where emotions run high & you're on your own the whole time. It's definitely something I've been thinking about, so thanks for confirming my concerns
With regards to buyins & BB, I'd ideally like to buy in for max as well but I put myself in a situation where I'm never rolled for what I'm about to play. So I agree & will drop this strategy once I'm fully rolled & focus on beating a level squarely like say NL10 & move on NL 20 & so forth.
Appreciate the tips & insight, thanks bro!

This is a big leak for many people. It's not easy. You just need to remember that it is part of the process though. There will always be both ups and downs.

All the best in your move up attempts and let me know how it goes for you!

Nathan Williams · Nov 19, 2019

Talden said:
Hey Nathan, thanks for doing this. Ya CC really is a great place to learn and share at. And with the additions of the AMA threads it really is helpful. I am a subscriber at your site as well. Looking forward to more articles and answers. Peace.

I agree, CC is the best major poker forum out there. Good to see many pros doing AMA's on here now also. Thanks for following my website as well. Many more poker articles/videos coming!

Ask BlackRain79 Anything About Cash Games

TPC

Legend

lkmolina

Rising Star

TheGenera1

Visionary

Shells

Carpe diem!

azforlife

Legend

Shadyginzo

Rising Star

nabmom

Moderator

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

TheGenera1

Visionary

Shadyginzo

Rising Star

Dimitris

Enthusiast

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Dimitris

Enthusiast

YKCaiTLH1314

Rock Star

azforlife

Legend

Talden

Legend

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

Nathan Williams

Poker Pro

About CardsChat

Our Community

Our Site