Did i overplay the river?

[Noodeloo]

this is the hand -
888Poker, Hold'em No Limit - 50/100 (10 ante) - 8 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

Noodeloo (UTG): 3,532 (35 bb)
Alvydas72 (UTG+1): 2,992 (30 bb)
ageuns2015 (MP): 2,892 (29 bb)
Xando1969 (MP+1): 2,992 (30 bb)
Marar27 (CO): 2,932 (29 bb)
Mr.trouble1 (BU): 2,886 (29 bb)
colpaertjp (SB): 2,892 (29 bb)
RunGooder (BB): 2,882 (29 bb)

Pre-Flop: (230) Hero (Noodeloo) is UTG with A♠ K♠
Noodeloo (UTG) raises to 200, 4 players fold, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 200, 1 fold, RunGooder (BB) calls 100

Flop: (730) A♣ 3♦ 7♦ (3 players)
RunGooder (BB) checks, Noodeloo (UTG) bets 306, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 306, RunGooder (BB) folds

Turn: (1,342) J♦ (2 players)
Noodeloo (UTG) bets 832, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 832

River: (3,006) 7♠ (2 players)
Noodeloo (UTG) bets 2,184 (all-in), Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 1,538 (all-in)

Total pot: 6,082

Showdown:
Noodeloo (UTG) shows A♠ K♠ (two pair, Aces and Sevens)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 71%, Flop: 63%, Turn: 0%, River: 0%)

Mr.trouble1 (BU) shows K♦ Q♦ (a flush, King high)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 29%, Flop: 37%, Turn: 100%, River: 100%)

Mr.trouble1 (BU) wins 6,082

question is - should i check the turn or check the river ever or is my line fine? Damn im so results orientated....

 

[woraphatman]

Check the river it ok villain can call turn 62% pot. pot control, avoids losing your stack to a flush. If villain bets small, you can call for value; if villain jams big, you can fold safely or bet 1/4

 

[schtiuky]

I would have check after the flush possibility and bet small after the second 7 its clear that if it calls you on that border your out. A3, A7, AJ or any flush.

 

[Goggelheimer]

Try to use the free GTO Wizard analysis.
I think check Turn is fine with this nut changing Turn.
If villain checks the Turn, you can try to bet 1/2 pot on the River.
If villain bet the Turn it depends on the sizing all bets up to 1/3 is a call, the rest is a fold I think.
After you tried to stab the River for 1/2 pot if villain checked the Turn, what do you think calls your bet?
The question on the River 7 is, how do you evaluate your hand, do you see it as bluffcatcher for any weaker AX, any other weaker two pair.
Villain has all sets and flushes that beat you massively in his range (AA, JJ, 33, 22, all flush kombos from AdKd to Ad2d, even the KdXd and QdXd combos, also all other combos of Xdiamond Xdiamond in his range).

 

[dreamer13]

Some strong hands that might be ahead 50%+ of the time even after a call should also be checked because if you bet and get raised, you might have to fold.When out of position on the river in medium or large pots with a mediocre made hand, such as top pair with a bad kicker or middle pair with a good kicker, you should generally check because most players will call the river with a range consisting mostly of better hands. This is especially true if you bet the flop and turn with a strong, but slightly overvalued, hand.

 

[eetenor]

this is the hand -
888Poker, Hold'em No Limit - 50/100 (10 ante) - 8 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

Noodeloo (UTG): 3,532 (35 bb)
Alvydas72 (UTG+1): 2,992 (30 bb)
ageuns2015 (MP): 2,892 (29 bb)
Xando1969 (MP+1): 2,992 (30 bb)
Marar27 (CO): 2,932 (29 bb)
Mr.trouble1 (BU): 2,886 (29 bb)
colpaertjp (SB): 2,892 (29 bb)
RunGooder (BB): 2,882 (29 bb)

Pre-Flop: (230) Hero (Noodeloo) is UTG with A♠ K♠
Noodeloo (UTG) raises to 200, 4 players fold, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 200, 1 fold, RunGooder (BB) calls 100

Flop: (730) A♣ 3♦ 7♦ (3 players)
RunGooder (BB) checks, Noodeloo (UTG) bets 306, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 306, RunGooder (BB) folds

Turn: (1,342) J♦ (2 players)
Noodeloo (UTG) bets 832, Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 832

River: (3,006) 7♠ (2 players)
Noodeloo (UTG) bets 2,184 (all-in), Mr.trouble1 (BU) calls 1,538 (all-in)

Total pot: 6,082

Showdown:
Noodeloo (UTG) shows A♠ K♠ (two pair, Aces and Sevens)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 71%, Flop: 63%, Turn: 0%, River: 0%)

Mr.trouble1 (BU) shows K♦ Q♦ (a flush, King high)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 29%, Flop: 37%, Turn: 100%, River: 100%)

Mr.trouble1 (BU) wins 6,082

question is - should i check the turn or check the river ever or is my line fine? Damn im so results orientated....

BU range is wide because they have position throughout the hand. therefore they have way more combos of flush draws than AX hands as 2 Aces are blocked. further one of the Ace combos includes all the diamonds so yes the turn flush should make us slow down.
Why? It is not just that we can be losing on turn but what do we get value from when we bet the turn?

Take the time to build turn ranges for V it will help you improve your in game decisions

 

[monkeytilter]

Yes you over-played the river

What calls an all in that you beat?
What are you getting value from?
A weaker Ace? Yes but that is so few hands compared to all the flushes, trips, full houses villain can have once they have called chunky turn bet.

You haven't said what buy in this game was but at micro/freeroll, this would have been my play (exploitable by better players, but that's when the real poker starts)

Bet bigger flop (~66%) - you have big value hand, get value for it and charge the draws (there can be plenty on this flop)

Turn bet small 25% - the value of your hand has reduced significantly now a flush may have landed for villain, though we shouldn't be panicking, just show a little caution, there are still hands we can get some value from and we don't want a 4 flush rolling off on the river for free.

I'd check or bet 10% and fold to jam - the 7 is another disgusting card for us, we have very few 7s in our UTG range, BTN has plenty (and calling down flopped 2nd pair - which has now improved to trips - makes some sense).

Generally take away is think "Relative to the board what is my hand worth now?" rather than "I have top pair top kicker:BLAST OFF"

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
30BB effective you can do a bit more than a min-raise, but its not a big issue.

Flop
I think, your sizing of just under half pot is fine. With a stack to pot ratio of around 5 I would be willing to get it in at this point especially against BTN, who should not have to many two pair combos on this board.

Turn
This is a very bad card for you. It completes the frontline flushdraw, and it also complete AJ. If BTN is a huge 70% VPIP whale, this does not matter so much, because then he can have any AX, and you still beat most of them. But if BTN is reasonable, AQ and AJ are some of the main hands, you were trying to get value from on the flop, so you dont want to see a Q or J on the board. For this reason you should shift into showdown value mode and check. Most likely call one bet but fold, if he bet turn and jam river.

River
Unless you had information, that he was a huge whale, then you are just value owning yourself here. As played you should check and fold, because its highly unlikely, a decent player is jamming any worse hand for value. Of course if he bet something silly small, then just call.

 

[Noodeloo]

Thanks for the thoughts everyone - yes it was a freeroll so i didnt mind donking into a flush ! but its interesting to hear how you all play it . Agreed the nut changing turn is what is important in this hand.

 

[yomarianob]

Being a freeroll, I think you played it great, went for value, I like it.

In a bigger buy-in I would check fold the river. But it's not a big punt IMO how you played.