Moving on up, Cash Game Thread

[duggs]

what are you aiming to make him fold?

 

[IPlay]

10x 9x and 87

 

[MinhANguyen]

I think you need to slow down on some of your bluffs, especially at 25NL. People get too sticky with weak TP, 2nd pairs, and try to be heros way too often.

 

[IPlay]

I think you need to slow down on some of your bluffs, especially at 25NL. People get too sticky with weak TP, 2nd pairs, and try to be heros way too often.

Totally agree, I was looking through database last night and have been called by 2nd pair or top pair no kicker about 3-4 times for stacks. If I bluff, I am pretty much just 3 betting light pre, cbetting flops, and the occasional x/raise a cbet and shutting down when called. Also, choosing villains more correctly.

My other goal for the weekend is to just not call any pot sized bets unless I have close to the nuts, at 5/10NL people show up with bluffs often in these spots but at 25 it has been the nuts every time. No matter how unlikely it is that they have it and how much weakness I have shown, they are potting with the nuts, not as a bluff.

The majority of the 25NL player pool run like 35/8 stats so its safe to say they probably are not bluffing often and not hand reading enough to know my range isn't strong enough to call a bet that large. Or they are owning me and making me level myself buuuttttt, I doubt it

 

[duggs]

10x 9x and 87

these hands will certainly fold to a smaller bet if they are folding.

 

[IPlay]

Well, 7k hands of run bad at 25NL down. Hopefully it turns around soon, currently running 5 buy ins under EV and that doesn't even factor in all the times I have been coolered and haven't coolered anyone else. It is getting sickening, especially the timing. All in all my hand reading is spot on and I am getting good value in spots and am focusing on bluffing less even when I can rep big hands against a weak range from villain. They just don't fold.

Here is this beauty

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 99 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 1)
BB: 123.32 BB (VPIP: 30.30, PFR: 3.03, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 34)
UTG: 62 BB (VPIP: 22.73, PFR: 13.64, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 22)
MP: 86 BB (VPIP: 37.50, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 24)
Hero (CO): 135.96 BB
BTN: 87.68 BB (VPIP: 13.04, PFR: 13.04, 3Bet Preflop: 20.00, Hands: 25)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Q:club: K:club:

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, SB calls 2.6 BB, fold

Flop: (7 BB, 2 players) J:club: 3:diamond: A:club:
SB checks, Hero bets 5.48 BB, SB calls 5.48 BB

Turn: (17.96 BB, 2 players) 7:spade:
SB checks, Hero bets 13.08 BB, SB calls 13.08 BB

River: (44.12 BB, 2 players) 8:diamond:
SB checks, Hero checks

SB shows 9:spade: J:spade: (One Pair, Jacks)

SB wins 41.92 BB



Like, how does he call 2 streets with this hand OOP when he isn't going to like 1/3rd of the deck?? Is my bet sizing bad/obvious? Should I just check turn?

 

[MinhANguyen]

He's bad enough to being calling OOP from the small blind with J9s, so he's definitely bad enough to call OOP with 2nd pair no kicker OTF and OTT when you pretty much rep an ace. Yes, barreling twice is mandatory here. You fold out all gutshots/pocket pairs/most weak and possibly strong Jacks that people were taking a card off with on the flop. You have great equity, and if he has an ace, especially a big ace, you are going to get paid off. Bet sizing is good OTT imo: not too small, not too big. Flop go a little smaller, like 60-66%. Yours is too big; I think it's 78%. My default for a flop c-bet is around that much, and on this board, their calling range OTF is sort of inelastic, unless you bomb it for near pot or pot.

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 97.6 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)
UTG: 116.04 BB (VPIP: 41.18, PFR: 5.88, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 35)
Hero (MP): 113.2 BB
CO: 36.6 BB (VPIP: 42.86, PFR: 28.57, 3Bet Preflop: 16.67, Hands: 16)
BTN: 320.92 BB (VPIP: 42.86, PFR: 8.57, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 35)
SB: 131 BB (VPIP: 42.86, PFR: 42.86, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has K:club: A:heart:

UTG raises to 3 BB, Hero calls 3 BB, fold, fold, SB raises to 15 BB, fold, fold, Hero raises to 34.6 BB, SB raises to 131 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 78.6 BB and is all-in

Standard?

 

[luchoq10]

i think is standard because you are raising the raise of the sb, in the moment you take that line you have to call the all in, however you don't have stats of the player.

 

[IPlay]

i think is standard because you are raising the raise of the sb, in the moment you take that line you have to call the all in, however you don't have stats of the player.

I didn't 3 bet UTG because he has only raised 6% over 35 hands and I do have stats on SB 43/43 over 7 hands.

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 189.04 BB (VPIP: 75.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 4)
SB: 63.56 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 100.00, Hands: 4)
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 4)
UTG: 20.12 BB (VPIP: 75.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
Hero (MP): 112.24 BB
CO: 100 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 4)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has T:club: T:heart:

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, SB calls 2.6 BB, fold

Flop: (7 BB, 2 players) J:club: 6:heart: 9:spade:
SB bets 3.48 BB, Hero calls 3.48 BB

Turn: (13.96 BB, 2 players) T:spade:
SB bets 6.96 BB, Hero calls 6.96 BB

River: (27.88 BB, 2 players) A:heart:
SB raises to 50.12 BB and is all-in, fold,

 

[IPlay]

Looked at my 25NL graph for the first time in awhile and I used to be able to bluff... The 3 weeks I didn't play 25NL it transitioned everyone turned into the grand calling stations I guess. I have played 8k hands since I came back and just look, IDK what happened really. Stats are about the same as they were.

 

[Aces2w1n]

How.do u keep ur red line so good

 

[xdeucesx]

8k hands means absolutely nothing, keep grinding dawg.

 

[bitowl]

How.do u keep ur red line so good

+1 my redline is always garbage with random 10k hand samples of a positive slope. I get called down with absolute garbage in spots where bluff catching makes no sense.

Not so sure about folding that set of tens... donk donk jam within the first 4 hands? Such a good chance he's a whale (not bought in full stacked) who does that with AJ or under set... pretty gross regardless.

 

[MinhANguyen]

I think folding there is alright. Overbet shoves on the river are almost always the nuts. Sudden big changes in bet sizing indicates that he probably wants maximum value, as he missed value on the flop/turn. He may have an underset, but I think most of the times he's going to have a straight. I sometimes overbet shove the river myself and level people into calling me with bluff catchers, and it does look bluffy. Pretty sure he was donking with a draw, and KQ/78s got there. Don't think AJ is overbet jamming on a straight heavy board.

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 369.8 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)
Hero (BB): 100 BB
UTG: 110.8 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 5)
MP: 120.08 BB (VPIP: 100.00, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)
CO: 99.6 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 3)
BTN: 117.6 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 7:diamond: 3:club:

fold, MP calls 1 BB, fold, fold, SB calls 0.6 BB, Hero checks

Flop: (3 BB, 3 players) 3:diamond: K:club: 3:heart:
SB bets 3 BB, Hero calls 3 BB, MP calls 3 BB

Turn: (12 BB, 3 players) T:heart:
SB bets 8 BB, Hero calls 8 BB, MP calls 8 BB

River: (36 BB, 3 players) 2:spade:
SB bets 28 BB, fold, fold,

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BB): 100 BB
UTG: 117.32 BB (VPIP: 30.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 10)
CO: 39.48 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 10)
BTN: 98.6 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)
SB: 25.36 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has J:spade: J:diamond:

fold, fold, fold, SB calls 0.6 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, SB calls 3 BB

Flop: (8 BB, 2 players) 2:diamond: 9:club: 6:spade:
SB checks, Hero bets 5.28 BB, SB calls 5.28 BB

Turn: (18.56 BB, 2 players) K:spade:
SB checks, Hero checks

River: (18.56 BB, 2 players) 5:club:
SB raises to 16.08 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 16.08 BB


PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

CO: 79.24 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 8.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
BTN: 98.88 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
SB: 139.08 BB (VPIP: 18.18, PFR: 9.09, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
Hero (BB): 109.48 BB
UTG: 50 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 8.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
MP: 45.4 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A:diamond: K:club:

fold, MP calls 1 BB, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 4.4 BB, MP calls 3.4 BB

Flop: (9.2 BB, 2 players) 4:club: 6:heart: 8:club:
Hero bets 6.28 BB, MP calls 6.28 BB

Turn: (21.76 BB, 2 players) 3:club:
Hero bets 11.08 BB, MP calls 11.08 BB

River: (43.92 BB, 2 players) 5:diamond:
Hero checks, MP checks


PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP: 65.64 BB (VPIP: 57.14, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)
CO: 40 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 14)
BTN: 142.96 BB (VPIP: 47.62, PFR: 47.62, 3Bet Preflop: 25.00, Hands: 21)
BB: 95.76 BB (VPIP: 52.38, PFR: 19.05, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 21)
Hero (UTG): 100 BB

BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1 BB) Hero has K:spade: J:spade:

Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB raises to 8.76 BB, Hero calls 5.76 BB

Flop: (17.52 BB, 2 players) K:diamond: J:club: Q:diamond:
BB bets 11 BB, Hero calls 11 BB

Turn: (39.52 BB, 2 players) 2:heart:
BB bets 16 BB, Hero calls 16 BB

River: (71.52 BB, 2 players) A:club:
BB bets 20 BB, Hero calls 20 BB


PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 37.4 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 7.14, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 29)
SB: 34.6 BB (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
BB: 86.36 BB (VPIP: 46.43, PFR: 46.43, 3Bet Preflop: 42.86, Hands: 29)
UTG: 98.6 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
Hero (CO): 133.64 BB

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A:spade: A:diamond:

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, BB raises to 9.4 BB, Hero raises to 22.6 BB, BB raises to 35.8 BB, Hero calls 13.2 BB

Flop: (72 BB, 2 players) J:club: Q:spade: 3:club:
BB raises to 50.56 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 50.56 BB

Turn: (173.12 BB, 2 players) 6:club:

River: (173.12 BB, 2 players) T:diamond:

 

[akaRobbo]

JJ I prob bet turn for value, always calling his jam OTR ap

AK X/c turn

KJ fine, can't fold river

AA please just rip it pre, fish is never getting away from us

 

[IPlay]

About the red line, people used to fold believe it or not. Lol, I have gotten people to fold QQ a couple times preflop lately though with a light 4 bet. /brag

This is one of the first hands I posted but never gave results, I still can't believe he folded.

PokerStars - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 48.6 BB
BB: 262.2 BB
UTG: 103 BB
Hero (CO): 104.4 BB
BTN: 15.4 BB

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has T:spade: T:club:

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, BB calls 2 BB

Flop: (6.4 BB, 2 players) A:heart: 2:heart: J:spade:
BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: (6.4 BB, 2 players) 9:spade:
BB checks, Hero bets 4.2 BB, BB calls 4.2 BB

River: (14.8 BB, 2 players) 8:spade:
BB bets 14.8 BB, Hero raises to 52.4 BB, fold

BB mucks 2:spade: 3:spade: (Flush, Jack High)

Hero wins 42.2 BB

My redline has been on a decline though since I lowered my cbet % and am taking more x/call lines to induce value from bluffs. I think I may be doing that too much though.

Sorry for the low quality hands guys, I am just getting really confused about how I can't win for the life of me.

In the 73o hand, villain had K10o but I still think I have to fold there, right?

The set of 10s hands villain showed up with AJ and I think this hand is a little closer too a call but I have just seen the nuts every time I call in this spot and was focusing on not paying off big river bets. Like Minh said, his line looked a lot like a donk with a draw that got there and wanted max value and thats what I went with.

The AA hand, IDK why I didn't just ship it pre even though I don't think it would change anything. Idk why I even posted that hand, I drunk posted a little bit last night and was feeling salty about it I guess, lol.

 

[MinhANguyen]

JJ - Checking and calling off is fine. Allows him to take a stab at the pot once we show weakness. Super dry board, and if we get called OTT we're probably beat. Checking allows to bluff at it with air.

AK - Check-fold or check-call flop. Hits a limping range pretty well, too draw heavy as well. Almost all pocket pairs are going to take a card off. I don't expect him to be folding a lot.

KJ - UTG vs BB 3-bet I probably end up mucking. I would consider calling if he had high 3-bet % or BTN vs blind. They usually aren't messing around here. I think flop and turn are okay, but OTR I think you're almost always beat. I think folding or jamming and turning your hand into a bluff is better than calling down. He has a ton of better 2PR/some set combos by the river.

AA - agree with ripping it pre

Wow, folding a backdoored flush. Sick fold.

 

[MinhANguyen]

73o hand is probably a call. We're definitely good here a good amount of the time, but sometimes we will be beat. I'd be a little more wary if he had potted it or overbet it. Only hand that really beats you is A3s/K3s (don't think many people limp behind with K3s in the SB though), and by flatting flop and turn we're really underrepped. Also since we have a 3 and there are 2's on the flop, it's unlikely opponent has a 3.

Just wondering about the 1010 hand. What was the plan for it? If I had a pair of jacks, I'd check behind flop and call turn bet, and most likely fold to river bet unless opponent is aggro. But are you planning to call turn bet here and fold to river aggression?? I think I would have c-bet flop, but I don't know if that is a mistake or not.

 

[IPlay]

73o hand is probably a call. We're definitely good here a good amount of the time, but sometimes we will be beat. I'd be a little more wary if he had potted it or overbet it. Only hand that really beats you is A3s/K3s (don't think many people limp behind with K3s in the SB though), and by flatting flop and turn we're really underrepped. Also since we have a 3 and there are 2's on the flop, it's unlikely opponent has a 3.

Just wondering about the 1010 hand. What was the plan for it? If I had a pair of jacks, I'd check behind flop and call turn bet, and most likely fold to river bet unless opponent is aggro. But are you planning to call turn bet here and fold to river aggression?? I think I would have c-bet flop, but I don't know if that is a mistake or not.

What about MP in the 73o hand? If it is heads up I snap all day but there is a 16/16 firing 3 streets into 2 people and one is a fish with a super wide range that has a lot of 3x that is still behind me. I also think SB limps wider in this spot because the fish is in the pot so he has more 3x then usual. K10 is literally the only combo that he plays like this that I beat and SB is never bluffing here.

1010 hand, villain donked and I floated in position because he could do this with any pair, any draw, some random AQ hand that is played odd.

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

CO: 101.84 BB (VPIP: 35.29, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 17)
BTN: 81.76 BB (VPIP: 47.06, PFR: 47.06, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 17)
SB: 98.24 BB (VPIP: 35.29, PFR: 29.41, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 17)
BB: 101.4 BB (VPIP: 22.22, PFR: 11.11, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 9)
UTG: 102.28 BB (VPIP: 23.53, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 17)
Hero (MP): 188.04 BB

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Q:spade: A:spade:

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, BTN calls 3 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (7.4 BB, 2 players) 2:heart: 2:diamond: A:diamond:
Hero bets 5.68 BB, BTN calls 5.68 BB

Turn: (18.76 BB, 2 players) 4:club:
Hero bets 12.48 BB, BTN calls 12.48 BB

River: (43.72 BB, 2 players) 7:diamond:
Hero bets 22.48 BB, BTN raises to 44.96 BB, fold,

 

[IPlay]

PokerStars - $0.25 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 248.76 BB (VPIP: 11.11, PFR: 11.11, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 18)
UTG: 103.72 BB (VPIP: 11.11, PFR: 5.56, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 18)
CO: 164.44 BB (VPIP: 18.75, PFR: 12.50, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 18)
Hero (BTN): 192.4 BB
SB: 152.2 BB (VPIP: 37.50, PFR: 18.75, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 18)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has T:diamond: J:heart:

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, BB raises to 11.4 BB, Hero calls 8.4 BB

Flop: (23.2 BB, 2 players) J:spade: 3:diamond: 6:club:
BB bets 16.6 BB, Hero calls 16.6 BB

Turn: (56.4 BB, 2 players) T:heart:
BB bets 32.2 BB, Hero calls 32.2 BB

River: (120.8 BB, 2 players) Q:spade:
BB checks, Hero ???

Too loose of a defend pre? Is it ok 200bbs deep with position? I really feel like I should of raised turn but does that look too strong here? What is your move on river?