My Biggest Hold'em Weakness...

AlbieTross · Feb 19, 2018

I'm dealt AK or any Ace-Face-Card Hand. I raise maybe 3 or 4 big blinds, depending on the situation and two or three players call.
The flop comes 3, 7, 8 or any combination of lower cards that don't help my hand at all.
What should my next move be? Do I bet some to protect my pre-flop raise or do I check? If I check someone almost always bets big and I fold, so I'm not sure what my best options are in this situation.

NBB · Feb 19, 2018

If you are constantly getting 3-4 responders when you raise then you need to make it more expensive for them to call your raises.

Note: it also depends on when you have made your raises, if your raises came after the flop, then your opponents are already valued in the hand, you probably should be extremely cautious going forward at that point.

AlbieTross · Feb 19, 2018

NBB said:
If you are constantly getting 3-4 responders when you raise then you need to make it more expensive for them to call your raises.

Note: it also depends on when you have made your raises, if your raises came after the flop, then your opponents are already valued in the hand, you probably should be extremely cautious going forward at that point.

That's only sometimes.Say only one person calls my raise in this situation. What would you say is my best next move?

ritehere · Feb 19, 2018

Adjust your raises, don;t always go with the 3or 4 times the BB. It makes you pretty easy to read.

ritehere · Feb 19, 2018

And a continuation bet would likely put you on the road to tilt.

NBB · Feb 19, 2018

AlbieTross said:
That's only sometimes.Say only one person calls my raise in this situation. What would you say is my best next move?

you never explained when you made your raise was it after the flop when your opponents were able to see what cards were on the table or was it pre-flop

Not knowing what cards will flop and still calling your 3-4 blind raises by numerous players tells me you are at a table with either complete donkies or everyone has strong hands which can mean trouble for your A/K

nmate · Feb 19, 2018

i wouldn't c-bet on an 8-7-x flop with multiple players in the hand. doesn't hit your range well.

hugh blair · Feb 20, 2018

Either go all in preflop wih AK if blinds are high because now with all them limpers and ragy flop you gota check fold good luck in future

grayfox84 · Feb 20, 2018

AK

The biggest change to my game in the last few years was a complete redesign of the way I took the game.

Asking if you should C-bet a flop with a run out like that is too vague and here is why:

It doesn't account for position or ranges.

Yes starting hand ranking does matter, but the game so much more.

Start thinking what you have as an incomplete picture.

A range of hands that you could be holding. UTG's range of hands should be a lot tighter of a range than someone in late position.

Also, when bets, raises, happen, it can narrow a range down.

So if you make a raise from early position it is very unlikely this flop hit you at all. It's not likely the flop hit you with a raise period, but from a middle to late position a 78suited hand could definitely be in your range.

But in general, you get the point... making a raise preflop will narrow a range slightly, and this board is unfavorable for ya.

So betting out here would not be great if you were the preflop raiser from Early.

Now say you had 78 suited, and were a middle to early position preflop raiser, and the flop came out with a Broadway type flop. You could definitely rep that range.

You can also start making raised, and called based solely that the board texture is unfavorable for certain ranges.

AlbieTross · Feb 20, 2018

grayfox84 said:
The biggest change to my game in the last few years was a complete redesign of the way I took the game.

Asking if you should C-bet a flop with a run out like that is too vague and here is why:

It doesn't account for position or ranges.

Yes starting hand ranking does matter, but the game so much more.

Start thinking what you have as an incomplete picture.

A range of hands that you could be holding. UTG's range of hands should be a lot tighter of a range than someone in late position.

Also, when bets, raises, happen, it can narrow a range down.

So if you make a raise from early position it is very unlikely this flop hit you at all. It's not likely the flop hit you with a raise period, but from a middle to late position a 78suited hand could definitely be in your range.

But in general, you get the point... making a raise preflop will narrow a range slightly, and this board is unfavorable for ya.

So betting out here would not be great if you were the preflop raiser from Early.

Now say you had 78 suited, and were a middle to early position preflop raiser, and the flop came out with a Broadway type flop. You could definitely rep that range.

You can also start making raised, and called based solely that the board texture is unfavorable for certain ranges.

Appreciate it, thanks!

terryk · Feb 20, 2018

Well said,grayfox! Great post,,,,:top:

dbchristy · Feb 20, 2018

I think I use the small ball effect with drawing cards. they are drwing after all a small c bet will usually get me the info i need. but im still in training

radartodd69 · Feb 20, 2018

I would have to say check/fold is best bet against that many players.Although it's hard for a person to believe their luck when they get a flop without the ace or king.

PKRNRS · Feb 20, 2018

I don't raise Ax. I will only call with it if possible or fold it. AT and higher I will raise depending on position. I will dump it off if a catch nothing on the flop. I'm not putting any money into the pot if I didn't catch any piece of it. Even if I raise preflop with suited AK, if it misses the flop then I'm waiting to fold. Only if I read the table weak and passive will I c-bet. I see it time and again that players will call you to the river with their bottom pair even though you represent a strong hand. Yes your AK didn't pair and their Q3 off paired a 3 from the broad and they win because they forgot to fold to big bets.

BigRedRooster · Feb 20, 2018

PKRNRS said:
I don't raise Ax. I will only call with it if possible or fold it. AT and higher I will raise depending on position. I will dump it off if a catch nothing on the flop. I'm not putting any money into the pot if I didn't catch any piece of it. Even if I raise preflop with suited AK, if it misses the flop then I'm waiting to fold. Only if I read the table weak and passive will I c-bet. I see it time and again that players will call you to the river with their bottom pair even though you represent a strong hand. Yes your AK didn't pair and their Q3 off paired a 3 from the broad and they win because they forgot to fold to big bets.

I like this. I'm new to the game and this board is helping loads. I keep faith and love in my AK and the like far too long. Getting mullered by low pairs on the river. It's heart breaking, but at the end of the day, I've not been playing the hands right.
Cheers all.

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