Game Theory

LarkMarlow · Apr 30, 2010

Does anyone know of a book or books that are about Game Theory as applied specifically to poker? Or online article/s? Or vid/s?

Or better yet, is there a Game Theory savvy CCer who can cohesively explain, in plain English, the basic principles of this approach?

I've read some stuff written by Chris Ferguson and a snippet here and there by Vanessa Rousso but haven't been able to find a comprehensive guide that pulls it all together.

Stu_Ungar · Apr 30, 2010

LarkMarlow said:
Does anyone know of a book or books that are about Game Theory as applied specifically to poker? Or online article/s? Or vid/s?

Or better yet, is there a Game Theory savvy CCer who can cohesively explain, in plain English, the basic principles of this approach?

I've read some stuff written by Chris Ferguson and a snippet here and there by Vanessa Rousso but haven't been able to find a comprehensive guide that pulls it all together.

Mathematics of Poker by Bill Chen

TBH you wont be able to apply it until your opponents are actively exploiting and adapting to you. If your opponents dont adapt and take +EV lines then you cant really play in such a way as to make them indifferent to your actions.. and TBH even if you could it would be the least profitable way of playing them.

Optimal poker really only begins somewhere between 200NL and 1000NL

bigjoker66 · Apr 30, 2010

LarkMarlow said:
Does anyone know of a book or books that are about Game Theory as applied specifically to poker? Or online article/s? Or vid/s?

Or better yet, is there a Game Theory savvy CCer who can cohesively explain, in plain English, the basic principles of this approach?

I've read some stuff written by Chris Ferguson and a snippet here and there by Vanessa Rousso but haven't been able to find a comprehensive guide that pulls it all together.

This is an old book, but still relevant.

look at: http://www.twoplustwo.com/books/poker/theory-of-poker/

I have not read it myself yet.

Stu_Ungar · May 1, 2010

bigjoker66 said:
This is an old book, but still relevant.

look at: http://www.twoplustwo.com/books/poker/theory-of-poker/

I have not read it myself yet.

This book isn't about game theory.

Its a good book, definitely worth a read, but it isnt about game theory.

postflopper · May 1, 2010

Caro's books are always worth a read.

Stu_Ungar · May 1, 2010

postflopper said:
Caro's books are always worth a read.

Caro has written a book on Game Theory?

Link please.

fletchdad · May 1, 2010

I am always up to learn something new. What exactly is Game Theory? (If this is explainable in a few words.)

Stu_Ungar · May 1, 2010

fletchdad said:
I am always up to learn something new. What exactly is Game Theory? (If this is explainable in a few words.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory

Xavier · May 2, 2010

I studied Game Theory at University.
Never applied it to poker though.
Its probably something that will only become useful at high stakes imo.

LarkMarlow · May 2, 2010

Xavier said:
Its probably something that will only become useful at high stakes imo.

Stu Ungar alluded as much also. Why is this so? Because, beyond the reasons Stu cited, game theorists assume that everyone is doing their best or playing at the same level of understanding and skill?

On another note, Chris Ferguson (primarily a tournament player) has said that when he plays he is focussed on how he can lose the least rather than win the most. Is this approach Game Theory related?

Lastly, Stu thanks for the link, I think.

Seems very complicated to me, even after two readings. I'm going to hit it a couple more times because for some reson I am fascinated by the concept.

cardplayer52 · May 2, 2010

Xavier said:
I studied Game Theory at University.
Never applied it to poker though.
Its probably something that will only become useful at high stakes imo.

IMO a good knowlege of game theory would be very useful at all stakes. ofc it wouldn't be the most profitable line to take at most stakes below 200nl but it would be a good guide as to how to adjust towards the most +EV play.

swrittenb · May 2, 2010

Stu_Ungar said:
Mathematics of Poker by Bill Chen

TBH you wont be able to apply it until your opponents are actively exploiting and adapting to you. If your opponents dont adapt and take +EV lines then you cant really play in such a way as to make them indifferent to your actions.. and TBH even if you could it would be the least profitable way of playing them.

Optimal poker really only begins somewhere between 200NL and 1000NL

Yes, agreed with the above comments - I own Mathematics of Poker. This book is fascinating theoretically, but does not apply to the micro stakes because people aren't playing at a level in which you need this level of thinking to beat them. That said, it really is a well written book.

fletchdad · May 3, 2010

Stu_Ungar said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory

Thanks as always for the info Stu.
Interesting read. Just when I think I dont have enough time to learn the stuff I already have planned, I add something else......

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