High Stake Turbo SnGs

theskillzdatklls · May 23, 2008

The time I really started to improve my poker game was when I looked at exposed hole cards of the sunday million FT. Everything was smooth sailing from there.

A few times lately, I've taken a peek into the $300-$1000 turbo 9 person SnG tables. The kind of poker they all play is absolutely ludicrous - I don't even know how they call it poker, it seems like the worlds biggest gamble. Every single hand (vast majority in reality) someone shoves all in 2-3k chips on 300-400 blind totals. My question is... WHY? If all they do is shove shove shove, where is the skill? its like oh my, A2? perfect, all in. which is pretty much how they play. more often than not they are called out by another A6. I rarely see anyone 3x raise, even rarer folded to BB, rarer yet, a single limp, anywhere.

BelgoSuisse · May 23, 2008

Because they have a deep understanding of ICM, and because at these blind levels, standard raises would very likely be 3-bet all-in, so it's just better to open-shove instead.

It looks a lot like a gamble because it's a high variance game. Doesn't mean the best players don't have a significant +EV.

theskillzdatklls · May 23, 2008

interesting, i thought i knew all the poker lingo, but i'd never even heard of ICM before. i read a huge article about it, fun stuff. still, i'm shying away BIG time from turbos ( i used to be a turbo lover ) and moving more towards other stuff, I feel like ICM is more useful in a turbo situation than a regular game, correct? I much prefer to play by knowledge anyway rather than programs.

Monoxide · May 23, 2008

theskillzdatklls said:
The time I really started to improve my poker game was when I looked at exposed hole cards of the sunday million FT. Everything was smooth sailing from there.

A few times lately, I've taken a peek into the $300-$1000 turbo 9 person SnG tables. The kind of poker they all play is absolutely ludicrous - I don't even know how they call it poker, it seems like the worlds biggest gamble. Every single hand (vast majority in reality) someone shoves all in 2-3k chips on 300-400 blind totals. My question is... WHY? If all they do is shove shove shove, where is the skill? its like oh my, A2? perfect, all in. which is pretty much how they play. more often than not they are called out by another A6. I rarely see anyone 3x raise, even rarer folded to BB, rarer yet, a single limp, anywhere.

That is the most profitable way to win turbo sit and gos.

theskillzdatklls · May 23, 2008

As a follow-up question, in lower stakes, $5-$13 as I play, I practically never see this happen. Would a player that would use this strategy @ a lower stake be at a strong advantage?

feitr · May 23, 2008

Good players will do it at lower stakes. The fact is, for turbo games, if you try and raise somebody after you is probably going to 3 bet shove. When you are HU it is even worse because it is almost 100% shove from the SB, and then it is just who gets lucky enough to get a hand good enough to call and who lucks out once both are all in. But you don't really have any other option, since if you fold to shoves and fold your SB soon your stack becomes so small that your opponent basically gets a free flip at knocking you out.

bw07507 · May 23, 2008

Check this out:

https://www.cardschat.com/f49/turbo-stt-guide-79867/

Its really a great guide to playing Turbo S&Gs. Should answer a lot of questions u have.

odinscott · May 23, 2008

That is also the reason that I dont play turbos often, lol.

Munchrs · May 24, 2008

i like gambooling

Badener · May 24, 2008

i played a sit: buy in 1000 dollar , but i lost

theskillzdatklls · May 24, 2008

Badener said:
i played a sit: buy in 1000 dollar , but i lost

dang losing $1,000 in 30 minutes i can't imagine. i have a nice roll that i worked up for $0 so far (1.9k), but with BRM i only wish i had the capability to enter the $215 weekly FL tournament or something like that.. but $1000 (esp turbo) is outta my comprehension.
better luck next time!

odinscott · May 24, 2008

Badener said:
i played a sit: buy in 1000 dollar , but i lost

On Stars? HU or a STT?

sliver101 · May 24, 2008

Theorem of Blind Stealing in Single Table Tournaments
had never heard of icm either but this seems a good article on it

TexGuy · May 24, 2008

ICM: Independent Chip Modeling. Had to look it up.

Munchrs · May 24, 2008

how many CC'ers play SNGs? coz it seems none know about ICM and it is really the most vital part of SNGs.

OzExorcist · May 25, 2008

Munchrs said:
how many CC'ers play SNGs? coz it seems none know about ICM and it is really the most vital part of SNGs.

I do, and while I don't use ICM calculators or anything, I apply the general concepts to my play.

Munchrs · May 26, 2008

OzExorcist said:
I do, and while I don't use ICM calculators or anything, I apply the general concepts to my play.

im the same. cant/wont pay for software lol

theskillzdatklls · May 26, 2008

2nd follow up question: if 9 "pro players" sat down at the office and played their $565 turbo games and booted up their software to go with it - and the software tells them what to do - how do they pull profits?

BelgoSuisse · May 26, 2008

Pro players don't need ICM software to tell them how to play. They can apply the concept without making the computations.

Besides, push-fold decisions are not entirely based on mathematics. You need to estimate your opponents' pushing and calling ranges properly, which is not entirely trivial.

Anyway, as in all poker games, with equally skilled players around the table, the game is -EV for all players involved and only +EV for the house. As always, if the games are +EV for some pros, than it means there are also high stakes fishes.

High Stake Turbo SnGs

theskillzdatklls

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BelgoSuisse

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theskillzdatklls

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Monoxide

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theskillzdatklls

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feitr

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bw07507

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odinscott

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Munchrs

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Badener

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theskillzdatklls

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odinscott

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sliver101

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TexGuy

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Munchrs

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OzExorcist

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