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Message: [QUOTE="-Phil Ivey27, post: 632249, member: 19294"] From: [B]"andreas kinell" [/B] Date: [B]Mon, 18 Apr 2005 12:50:53 +0200[/B] Local: [B]Mon, Apr 18 2005 6:50 am [/B] Subject: [B]Re: RNG's at Full Tilt.[/B] > Interesting transcript from Howard Lederer in a razz S&G with him tonight > regarding the RNG and card shuffling at Full Tilt. Figured some people > would be interested in reading... > Caitlin215 (Observer): i understand that FTP uses > action cards placed at random intervals to speed > up play is that true in ring games as well as > tourneys or are they just used in tourneys > Howard Lederer: our deal si totally random > Howard Lederer: action flops would be hard to > program > Caitlin215 (Observer): well i had the opportunity to > meet chris recently and i was talking to him about > Full Tilt Poker someone over heard and asked him if Full Tilt Poker used > action cards and he said yes placed at totally > random intervals but i wasnt sure if he was just > talking about toruuneys > esfd283: how would that be possible > Howard Lederer: you misheard > Shangri La (Observer): what are action cards? > Howard Lederer: he wwas either joking > Caitlin215 (Observer): i guess i did then > Howard Lederer: or you misheard > Howard Lederer: the notion of action cards is > funny to us > Shangri La (Observer): to Full Tilt Poker? > Howard Lederer: because we know how hard it > would be to pull off > Dakon (Observer): strange thing to joke about > Howard Lederer: and the risk of discovery would > be huge > Howard Lederer: our deal is rnadom on three levels > Howard Lederer: first we used an audited rng > Howard Lederer: but we also use a deck queue > Howard Lederer: basically each deck on the site is > put in a queue after it is used > Howard Lederer: then when we need a deck we > pick one at random > Howard Lederer: then we run it through the rng > Howard Lederer: then after each round has been > dealt > Howard Lederer: the remaining cards are shuffled > during the action > Caitlin215 (Observer): wait the deck that s in play > is shuffled during the action > Howard Lederer: there is no way to know what is > coming because trhe cardes are not set > Howard Lederer: right cait > Caitlin215 (Observer): now is that fair to shuffle the > deck once its in play? > Howard Lederer: since the deck is not set, you > can't cheat > Caitlin215 (Observer): ok thta makes sense > Howard Lederer: we areonly suffling the cards that > remain > Caitlin215 (Observer): but how would u be able to > cheat unless u found a way to ping the deck off > the server > Howard Lederer: if some how you could crack the > deck, it wouldn't help you at our site > Howard Lederer: I am not suggesting that it would > be easy the good news: a nice idea to shuffle the deck during play, it makes it way harder to cheat. the bad news: your play may actually change the next card to come. it doesn't really matter theoretically, but i feel uncomfortable when i know that, if i had bet one second later, i probably would not have been outdrawn and stuff like this. andreas From: [B]"UKPaul"[/B] Date: [B]Mon, 18 Apr 2005 12:06:58 +0100[/B] Local: [B]Mon, Apr 18 2005 7:06 am [/B] Subject: [B]Re: RNG's at Full Tilt.[/B] "andreas kinell" wrote in message > the bad news: > your play may actually change the next card to come. > it doesn't really matter theoretically, but i feel uncomfortable > when i know that, if i had bet one second later, i probably > would not have been outdrawn and stuff like this. > andreas Agreed, but it also means that next time you chuck 72o and the flop is 772 you dont feel quite so bad. [/QUOTE]

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