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Message: [QUOTE="N.D., post: 1139004, member: 30036"] I appreciate your reply because I feel like it's really constructive. I also appreciate the reminder of Chris' 100% rakeback left after your post. Having said that I feel it's necessary to point out something that had me confused before as well. I thought I understood Chris' management system well enough to breeze through the video + sit n' learn. I only missed a couple of questions and one I missed was when to leave the table. Assuming you sat with the 5% ideal, if you leave when your money's at 10% of your BR, you've doubled up. So that's the one I clicked. I know now that I wasn't paying proper attention. So at least I learned. Point is, the correct answer was that you should leave the table when your stack exceeds 10% of your BR. Just doubling up doesn't cut it. I'm going to see if I can't find an existing player rakeback. They're available from time to time. It's not 100%, but every little bit helps. Also I need to clarify. Chris' story has changed over time. The original story + podcast went something like this "I won my $2 and decided to try PLO 8lo figuring variance would be lower. I lost and tried different games, finally settling on no limit texas hold 'em". That's a big difference from his current story of "I decided to start with no limit texas hold 'em", now isn't it? So to get to another way my plan's different from Chris' is that I'm planning to focus on PLO. Not PLO 8lo and not NLHE. PLO at first and graduate to a combination of PLO and FLO once my BR can handle it. For tournaments I want to focus on NLHE + PLO + HORSE, but only at levels my BR can handle. I feel like the HORSE part of the equation helps to improve my overall game. I do want to be a better player overall, and if I can win money while I'm at it, so much the better. Like I said, only play tournaments when I'm at 1 or 2. Lately I've been miffed because the only freerolls I could get into have been the WSOP feeders. I'd rather do just as well for cash than a chance at a chance to win a main event seat. See Chris had the right idea when he was going to go with an omaha game. The problem with 8lo is that at the lowest levels many people don't understand the concept of the scoop let alone how to select a hand. A player at Chris' level would be bound to get schooled. I can only imagine all the quartering and worse. But at the lowest levels, PLO can be very profitable. Fewer people know what a good to great starting hand looks like, and almost everybody thinks they're French. But everytime I play I keep hearing Kenny Rogers singing "know when to fold 'em". A really good player who happens to play French style can do that because they know when to fold. Most players aren't even close to being that good. Realize that in PLO you're rarely risking a big chunk of your stack. Once you amass double your starting chips, you're on your way to playing even better. When you're surrounded by omaha players who are willing to play pocket trips and pocket flushes at a full table against raises and reraises, well, come on, all you can hear is "Cha-CHING!", they win with that junk once and think they're doing the right way only to lose it all in a few hands, so simple. Realize it's easier to get away from a hand in PLO, and as for pot odds, boy-howdy, it's beautiful. People just can't let go of a set, even bottom set, and yeah you can really take advantage. Others can't let go of a straight, again you can really take advantage. I admit that for a long time I could never fold a real hand to a potential hand. But now I can, if I'm looking at my hand + the board and it feels like I'll be outdrawn I can fold it. What surprises me is how many losers stay in with dummy ends of straights and weak flushes, so I can watch the hands play out and realize I made the right decision. I'm far from pro, but I'm strong enough in this one particular area. Also, another factor is that the bigger your stack the better you can play PLO. Some say the same for NLHE. I suppose there's some truth in there, but the problem is, throughout the game, your entire stack's at risk. Not so in PL and FL games. Once you have the maximum or better, you can play so much better. You can take more small risks and watch them pay out very well. Furthermore I've practiced from heads up to full table. Heads up and short handed against a weak player or two is so sweet. Easy pickins. At a full table it's easy in a different way. People don't necessarily give credit to the nit for knowing how to play well and it pays off. Let's just say I'm willing to take an educated risk. That I've observed and played my fair share at the lowest stakes and no stakes without any real goal beyond improving my game and learning from other people's both good and bad. I still think Chris could have regulated his BR a lot sooner if he had given PLO a real chance. More outs + more clueless individuals = easier winnings. I could be wrong, I'm no pro. It's just a very strong feeling combined with observation. [/QUOTE]

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