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Message: [QUOTE="TNRounder, post: 1348185, member: 62984"] Ok... I can calculate hand eqiuty as far as outs vs. unknown cards go and get that ratio and even convert it to a percentage if I want to. I have a formula X:1 X= (Y/Z)-1 Y=unknown cards Z=outs. This formula very accutarely calculates odd post turn but does not seem to work post flop. I was looking for a similar formula to figure the odds post flop. The rules of 4 and 2 are accurate enough to a point then they skew about 7 points...there's also a method to compensate for that. I just want to explore simple math formulas at each stage of a hand to calculate odds... for me it's easier to do the formula in my head than to simply memorize an odds table. I will check into pokerstove. I have heard alot of good things about it. thanks to all who responded thus far [/QUOTE]