Opinion; All River Showdown Hands Should be Tabled

Since I'm still a relative newcomer to the poker world (3 year rookie), I've always wondered why in some (live) venues/events players are allowed to muck a showdown hand without tabling the hand.

In my opinion - one (of many) areas where online poker is superior to live play is the fact all showdown hands are revealed.

It seems odd to me that a player can muck a losing hand on the river - without having to table the hand.


Anyone have some historical perspective on this point, why/how/when players were given the option / allowed to muck there hands at showdown rather than having to table the hand?

is related to strategy, if you are bluffin and finally realize the other player has the best hand, you fold but don´t want to show if there was a bluff or marginal hand. my humble opinion.

theANMATOR said:

Anyone have some historical perspective on this point, why/how/when players were given the option / allowed to muck there hands at showdown rather than having to table the hand?

Click to expand...

It has long been considered poor etiquette to override a losing players muck action. Loads of 'live' players that try online games have expressed they don't like software that doesn't follow this live etiquette. The most likely reason for the 'poor etiquette' reasoning is that a live game is a more personal environment and making a 'loser' show what they lost with is on a level with taunting.

Personally I don't care one way or another and am always amused by players that argue/get upset/etc. when it is handled one way or another in live games.

Jillychemung said:

It has long been considered poor etiquette to override a losing players muck action. Loads of 'live' players that try online games have expressed they don't like software that doesn't follow this live etiquette. The most likely reason for the 'poor etiquette' reasoning is that a live game is a more personal environment and making a 'loser' show what they lost with is on a level with taunting.

Personally I don't care one way or another and am always amused by players that argue/get upset/etc. when it is handled one way or another in live games.

Click to expand...

I have not played live as of yet, so my opinion may change in the future after I have. From my view mucking a losing hand on the river is comparable to a boxer staying on his stool, not coming out for the final round of the bout, although with relation to boxing, exhaustion of endurance is often a key factor. In poker that is not a factor.

To me - if a player has enough fortitude to bluff re-raise, or bluff lead, or make a river call - they should also have enough will power to table their hand, even though they know it is a losing hand. I don't see this as any type of taunt. However if this was a 'rule' that was created, I think it would make a lot more players less confident and willing to bluff on rivers. So that would clearly change the game mechanics on rivers. I don't know if we want that.


You mentioned "overriding" a losing players muck action. I didn't even know this was a thing. Do live players really do this?
I can see - and agree with you that this is very poor etiquette.

theANMATOR said:

You mentioned "overriding" a losing players muck action. I didn't even know this was a thing. Do live players really do this?
I can see - and agree with you that this is very poor etiquette.

Click to expand...

This is where arguments/fights/etc. happen. Players have asked to see a mucked hand and some dealers will show it, some won't.

theANMATOR said:

Anyone have some historical perspective on this point, why/how/when players were given the option / allowed to muck there hands at showdown rather than having to table the hand?

Click to expand...

Yes - I mucked a hand in a live cash game after seeing my opponent's trips. Bad move, I misread my hand!!! After mucking my hand, I realized I folded a winner.
I have played in a variety of poker rooms across North America and find that I have to learn the specific rules of each room.
Whether or not it should be mandatory - I am against it. A player should not have to reveal their strategy by turning over their 72o big, stupid bluff attempt. haha

I think it's in the rules in a lot of tournaments, but players don't enforce it against one another because they don't want it enforced against them.

Tournaments are usually handled much different than cash games. For tournaments the TDA rules are usually in effect and in those, exposing all-in hands and called hands is almost mandatory. Cash games is where the 'rules' are often less rigid.

Per TDA rules, if all players are allin in a tournament, all players are required to turn up their cards. If all players are not allin, they are not required to show their cards. The winner must show both cards to be able to claim the pot. In a cash game, it is not required to show your cards (unless you win the pot).

teepack said:

I think it's in the rules in a lot of tournaments, but players don't enforce it against one another because they don't want it enforced against them.

Click to expand...

I think so too.

I once witnessed a player refuse to turn over his hand first based on position.
He knew he would win the hand but asked the dealer to force the first player to act
to show his hand before he would and they made the first player do it.
This was one of his many ways of gaining info on how his opponents play.