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Message: [QUOTE="rileyl, post: 1427885, member: 38262"] You are missing the point...the point of the example was to illustrate the problems that arise when we play hands like Kxo and why it is better to play hands like 86s etc. Even though you are right about checking back the flop, it is completely irrelevant because I wasn't trying to decide whether or not we should C-Bet TPWK. Your point actually helps show why we should eliminate these hands from our range: Even when we hit the flop great for our hand, we are still forced to play passively. Meh. As I said in the article these ranges are just GUIDELINES. What hands you choose depends on your ability post-flop. FWIW, I show a profit with 54s in that position. I'm obviously not 3-Betting it every time, and it probably is one of the hands I add in last only when I reach I really big air : nut ratio. Obviously I would prefer to be 3-Betting Axs or 87s but I'll still 3-Bet QJs sometimes mostly depending on villain's post-flop tendencies. (likelyhood of paying off big etc.) The point is against a good villain with a wider range, we are not likely to get paid that big even when we flop a good hand so taking it down pre-flop isn't really that bad of thing. Again you are arguing such minor details and missing the big picture. I really wasn't concerned with exact numbers. I could make that number 72% and still wouldn't change the hand. You are a real numbers fanatic aren't you lol! If you must have numbers say >70% or so. I use probably because maybe sometimes I make the raise slightly bigger or smaller or whatever. I would be lying if I said I did it always. Again there are often too many factors to discuss for each decision...but the whole point of this guide was to get people thinking logically about the game. That means drawing there own conclusions in certain areas. With the whole standard thing...play a bunch of hands and you'll quickly realize what standard is. Thanks for reading! [/QUOTE]

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