Which would you rather have? First hand in MTT 10-7 or 2-2?

jdeliverer · Aug 9, 2008

Which would you rather have? 10-7 or 2-2? Let's get 100 responses!

Yes corrado363 I stole the idea, but let's see how it plays out

jdeliverer · Aug 9, 2008

Against Phil Hellmuth I'd take the 10-7 just to see his reaction when I beat his QQ, but I would rather take the 2-2 just because it's suited.

But seriously the 2-2 would be the easy pick because both of them are disguised when they hit their hand, but 2-2 even more so and you can win some big pots while having an easily foldable hand.

SeanyJ · Aug 9, 2008

Yeah those suited deuces are deadly.

Dwilius · Aug 9, 2008

I'll go with any pair, I like single gap semi-connectors.

switch0723 · Aug 9, 2008

I don't understand the thread. If i do pick 10-7 does it have to be against Phil Hellmuth?

naruto_miu · Aug 9, 2008

10/7 anyday, because with the right flop, your golden if not u can easily fold, 22 no good unless u hit a 2 and even then other sets still beat you

pifan · Aug 9, 2008

i pick 10/7 also because of the strait possabilities but i fold both of these hands most of the time

jokish123 · Aug 9, 2008

what the hell??? how can 22 be suited? This makes no sense to me................

nateogreato · Aug 9, 2008

Very funny responses

If your 22 is suited then I'd go with the 22 as well (toungue in cheek).

Seriously, without using a calculator on the odds this feels darn close to a coin flip. I prefer the 10-7 even if it's off becasue of the straight possibilities. Honestly, both hands are pretty hideous and I can't see why you would not just fold them and wait for a hand that you have a high probability of winning.

roundcat · Aug 9, 2008

10-7 because if you have 22 suited the deck is fixed.

corrado363 · Aug 10, 2008

jamesdadeliverer said:
Which would you rather have? 10-7 or 2-2? Let's get 100 responses!

Yes corrado363 I stole the idea, but let's see how it plays out

ah the masses seem to agree

AcesLA07 · Aug 10, 2008

Set mining with 22 ftw!

norbs286 · Aug 10, 2008

2 2 is something, 10 7 is nothing - Both have potential, however, statistically 2 2 has more potential - On head to head if I get 2 2 I go ALL IN!!

ysmisc · Aug 10, 2008

You have to remember that 2 2 in HU is a very strong hand - Will make your opponent running after you!
So I would go 2 2 OF COURSE.

hornellfred · Aug 10, 2008

I would like 10-7, because it has more outs to be a better hand than the 22. 22 has 2 outs. There are 6 outs to hit a better pair than the 2's though your straight chances are slim that is still more outs.

norbs286 · Aug 10, 2008

hornellfred said:
I would like 10-7, because it has more outs to be a better hand than the 22. 22 has 2 outs. There are 6 outs to hit a better pair than the 2's though your straight chances are slim that is still more outs.

That is true. However, when I choose the 2 2 I'm betting against the 6 outs of my opponent, which leaves me with many more (over 30!!) outs from which I will win with a 2 2!!

Sheepodog · Aug 10, 2008

Well, because it's first hand of a MTT, IF I would call with either hand (which is doubtful) I'd take the 10 - 7. Then I'd try to steal the pot with any flop.

Bigsmak · Aug 10, 2008

As its the first hand.. I'd want 10-7 as its so bloody easy to lay down. I hate first hands of a tournament. So many people wanting to play it.... I like to be able to look down and lay it down ASAP.... Its the last hand of the Tournament I want to win anyway...

2-2 suited BTW? Eh?

jdeliverer · Aug 10, 2008

norbs286 said:
2 2 is something, 10 7 is nothing - Both have potential, however, statistically 2 2 has more potential - On head to head if I get 2 2 I go ALL IN!!

Hmm... this is a very dangerous move. Think about it. AK is in a coinflip with many hands (pocket pairs), while only being way behind AA and KK. It dominates many Ax and Kx hands.

2-2 on the other hand, is in a coinflip most of the time as well (2 overcards), but only dominates hands like A-2, K-2, which will call all in very rarely. However, ANY pocket pair will be way ahead of 2-2 preflop.

This is why A-K is actually a much better hand than 2-2 (and why 2-2 is so dangerous) against the range your opponents will be calling with.

Sheepodog said:
Well, because it's first hand of a MTT, IF I would call with either hand (which is doubtful) I'd take the 10 - 7. Then I'd try to steal the pot with any flop.

Let me know if you ever find a MTT where you can steal a pot first hand.

MANAMAL · Aug 10, 2008

2 2

I love 2 2 if i can get in cheap, its a crusher hand when you hit because its well hidden, have taken down many chips with it and rarely lose with it when you hit. Just remember to get in cheap with it, no more than 5% of your stack.

ysmisc · Aug 11, 2008

jamesdadeliverer said:
Hmm... this is a very dangerous move. Think about it. AK is in a coinflip with many hands (pocket pairs), while only being way behind AA and KK. It dominates many Ax and Kx hands.

2-2 on the other hand, is in a coinflip most of the time as well (2 overcards), but only dominates hands like A-2, K-2, which will call all in very rarely. However, ANY pocket pair will be way ahead of 2-2 preflop.

This is why A-K is actually a much better hand than 2-2 (and why 2-2 is so dangerous) against the range your opponents will be calling with.

Let me know if you ever find a MTT where you can steal a pot first hand.

I think that you are wrong
According to the poker calculator

22 against SUITED AK
22 - 49.6%
AK suited - 49.7%
Coin flip

22 against NOT suited AK
22 - 52.8%
AK not suited - 46.7%

So I would go for 22

jdeliverer · Aug 11, 2008

ysmisc said:
I think that you are wrong
According to the poker calculator

22 against SUITED AK
22 - 49.6%
AK suited - 49.7%
Coin flip

22 against NOT suited AK
22 - 52.8%
AK not suited - 46.7%

So I would go for 22

You're not paying attention to what I'm saying. 22 is very slightly a favorite over AK yes, but 22 is not going to be up against AK every time. Much of the time you will get called with a larger pocket pair.

For example, when you are up against 99, AK has about a 50% chance of winning, whereas 22 has only 18% chance of winning. Against AA or KK, both hands are way behind.

So yes, the 1% advantage is fine for many scenarios, but those times when you go up against a pocket pair make AK significantly better.

ysmisc · Aug 12, 2008

jamesdadeliverer said:
You're not paying attention to what I'm saying. 22 is very slightly a favorite over AK yes, but 22 is not going to be up against AK every time. Much of the time you will get called with a larger pocket pair.

For example, when you are up against 99, AK has about a 50% chance of winning, whereas 22 has only 18% chance of winning. Against AA or KK, both hands are way behind.

So yes, the 1% advantage is fine for many scenarios, but those times when you go up against a pocket pair make AK significantly better.

With this of course I agree! I was talking about the mathematics of 22 versus AK that's all.

PyroPokerPlayer · Aug 12, 2008

22 suited lol pretty funny stuff. I would prefer 22 but 10 7 if a million donks push all in.

Which would you rather have? First hand in MTT 10-7 or 2-2?

Would you rather have 10-7os or 2-2 in the first hand of an MTT?

10-7 offsuit

2-2 (suited)

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