Best way to build a bankroll

NastyPocketz · Jul 21, 2011

Does anyone have any specific tips to share, I would love to start building a bank roll and start moving up the stakes, but at the moment find myself reaching for the credit card to top up all too often.

Is it best to try to start with cash tables, sit and goes or tournaments, or a combo of all 3 ?

Would you have a seperate account for cash table / tournament ?

Any help greatly appreciated

RVladimiro · Jul 21, 2011

NastyPocketz said:
Does anyone have any specific tips to share, I would love to start building a bank roll and start moving up the stakes, but at the moment find myself reaching for the credit card to top up all too often.

What stakes are you playing? Maybe you are playing above your skill and/or bankroll.

Is it best to try to start with cash tables, sit and goes or tournaments, or a combo of all 3 ?

IMHO it's best to play whatever you play best.

Would you have a seperate account for cash table / tournament ?

This doesn't make any sense to me. Why would you?

NastyPocketz · Jul 21, 2011

I`m playing small stake stuff like 0.02 and 0.05 cash tables. Tournaments I spend no more than about $8

Its all small stakes, and I have always played smaller stake poker, I paid $22 for a 450 man tournament on PKR and came 2nd, this made me think whether the reason I`m struggling at lower stakes stuff is because fish will call all the way to the river no matter what most of the time

But on the other hand I`m scared of increasing my stakes incase i tot up big loses. My ability on Pokerstars at the moment is 77, I`m not actually bad at poker, but seem to players that don`t have a clue or care about what there calling / raising

Would I be better investing in more expensive tournaments to hopefully cut out the all in fishes ?

The reason for 2 accounts was that you could track cash and tournment play easier, perhaps its a bad idea !

alaskabill · Jul 21, 2011

First of all, creating 2 accounts at one online site is against the the rules of any site I know of. If you do it they will kick you off and take your money. Now if you play only cash on one site and only tournaments on another site that of course would be fine.

Don't move up in level to play against better players. That's illogical. If you can't beat bad players, what makes you think that you can beat good players? This is a common mistake made by new or losing players. The better players might initially give your bluffs some more respect, but they will quickly figure you out, adjust their play and crush you.

You say you are "not bad" at poker. No offense but the truth is that if you were "not bad" at poker you wouldn't need to be "topping up" at the micro stakes.

What I would advise is to study one game that you enjoy playing the most, focus entirely on either tournaments or cash but pick one. Study. Read the strategy posts here, ask questions, post hand histories, play within your bankroll and you will get better. Here are some links to help you.

https://www.cardschat.com/f49/archive-compendium-195602/

https://www.cardschat.com/poker-strategy.php

https://www.cardschat.com/forum/learning-poker-57/building-a-baby-bankroll-181238/

Good luck to you.

YaMIzNoGouD · Jul 27, 2011

I can give you an advice in bankroll management which is essential in building a bankroll.

Ok first to build a BR you need to manage it. BR management is key without it you'll probably be playing in games that you can not afford to lose thus resulting in playing with "scared money".

This is a good brm for SnG. Source is p5s moderator jennifear.

Proper Bankroll Management Minimums:

$65 - $1.10 STTs
$90 - $1.10 18-man
$128 - $1.10 45-man,
$130 - $2.20 STTs
$210 - $5.25 HU
$215 - $3.30 STTs
$270 - $6.25 HU
$357 - $5.50 STTs
$416 - $3.25 45-man
$420 - $10.50 HU
$422 - $6.50 STTs
$440 - $2.20 MTTs, $2.20 180-man
$495 - $3.30 90-man

For MTTs 1-2% of your BR that means to be able to play a $1.10 freezeout you need $110

I suggest you grind micro SnGs $0.25c ,$0.50c ,$1.00 on Pokerstars. They are pretty soft IMO.

That's all i can think of for now. I'll add some more when something pops up.

Good luck to you bub.

pobe27mo · Jul 27, 2011

I think the most important advice is from alsakabill that you should stick to one game. When I started I quickly learnt that the play is slightly different for each game type so it is best to learn one type and your game will improve at that a lot faster.

brank · Jul 27, 2011

NastyPocketz said:
Its all small stakes, and I have always played smaller stake poker, I paid $22 for a 450 man tournament on PKR and came 2nd, this made me think whether the reason I`m struggling at lower stakes stuff is because fish will call all the way to the river no matter what most of the time

Actually this is what makes smaller stakes ridiculously easy to beat. At any level of poker you have to adjust to your opponents. Fish who call too much are the easiest to adjust to and exploit.

RVladimiro · Jul 27, 2011

That's the #1 reason I don't cbet if I have no equity against passive fish, they call with anything. Their 72o tends to be over our 65s...

peedee91 · Jul 31, 2011

I say try higher stakes...i dont know how you play but i have been told that my game will work well in higher stakes because those players are looking for my moves and playing against it so try higher stakes and see what happens

Zakky11 · Aug 1, 2011

Bonus whoring is the easiest way to build a bankroll. It is plain and simple.

alaskabill · Aug 1, 2011

peedee91 said:
I say try higher stakes...i dont know how you play but i have been told that my game will work well in higher stakes because those players are looking for my moves and playing against it so try higher stakes and see what happens

Okay, I'm going to rant here. If mods want to yell at me ban me etc I'll deal with it. This is the dumbest advice ever. If you can't beat micro stakes, which is filled with bad players how in the name of Jebus are you expected to beat higher stakes filled with better players? Your raises might get some credit initially but they will quickly adjust to your play and beat you. They will make these adjustments because they are stronger players.

In any other field would you ever consider competing against the best players because you were unable to beat the weaker players? For all of you Premier league fans that would be like promoting the last place team in the second division because their style is perfect for beating Man U.

In baseball, if you can't hit minor league pitching, they don't move you up to the majors.

Lately it seems like there are about three people who post who know what the hell they are talking about and a bunch of people giving a million bad replies to repetitive or just plain bad threads.

Frankly my post earlier in the thread was the best answer and that''s pretty sad since I will freely admit that I'm at best a moderately good micro grinder.

But by all means, move up to 5/10 where they respect your raises and let us all know how that works out for you.

(waiting to be yelled at by a mod)

Shwiggler · Aug 1, 2011

Use good BRM. Here is an example of the BRM I used when playing 25nl. I mapped this out and stuck with it. Definitely paid off.

Buy in $250 (10BI at $25NL)
-Will move up to $50NL when I have $500
-Will move down when I have $175 left ( 8.75 BI at $20NL)

When I reach $1000 I will be allowed to play $100NL
- Switch to 30BI Bankroll
-Will now need $6000 to move up to $200NL

When I reach 20BI I will take a one table stab at $200NL.

Having a solid plan similar to this will help you stay on track.

Ronaldadio · Aug 1, 2011

alaskabill said:
Okay, I'm going to rant here. If mods want to yell at me ban me etc I'll deal with it. This is the dumbest advice ever. If you can't beat micro stakes, which is filled with bad players how in the name of Jebus are you expected to beat higher stakes filled with better players? Your raises might get some credit initially but they will quickly adjust to your play and beat you. They will make these adjustments because they are stronger players.

In any other field would you ever consider competing against the best players because you were unable to beat the weaker players? For all of you Premier league fans that would be like promoting the last place team in the second division because their style is perfect for beating Man U.

In baseball, if you can't hit minor league pitching, they don't move you up to the majors.

Lately it seems like there are about three people who post who know what the hell they are talking about and a bunch of people giving a million bad replies to repetitive or just plain bad threads.

Frankly my post earlier in the thread was the best answer and that''s pretty sad since I will freely admit that I'm at best a moderately good micro grinder.

But by all means, move up to 5/10 where they respect your raises and let us all know how that works out for you.

(waiting to be yelled at by a mod)

Don`t be so stupid!!! You trying to tell me that playing against better players will be harder than playing against people who don`t have a clue what they are doing or why they are doing it?

Next u will be saying I will have more chance in a 100m sprint against my 72 year old father than I would against Usain Bolt - get a life

peedee91 · Aug 1, 2011

alaskabill, some of the moves that work on pros or better players lower stakes players arent even looking for...lower stakes players are to one dimensional......ex...i show a hand im doin it for a reason not being friendly and letting the table know what i have ....of course no one pays attention to what i am trying to tell them....stuff like that...maybe he needs to move up a level where people are looking for it

thebigdawg · Aug 1, 2011

I would say tournaments. Cash games can be a hard grind, unless you just think your a better cash game player overall I would stay away.

If your can play a lot games through out the day than play stt's with some mtt's thrown in. If you can only play a few games here and there than I recommend 45 man sngs with mtt's thrown in.

Tournaments player from what I have seen are a little weaker than cash game players, and tournaments is what built my roll up from nothing. GL in which ever way you go.

fugitive67 · Aug 1, 2011

if you are a big multi-table player, then there is some good advice on this site about how to win at cash games ... start with micro of course until you start winning consistently ... it's about patience, premium hands, but get the skinny from others on here or a book, im no expert

if you dont like to play more than 1 or 2 tables, then, IMO SnG is the way to go

then occasionally toss in a MTT, but make sure you have the time and energy ... if you get bored in an MTT you get busted .. .the MTT can be a good way to win a chunk of $$ at once, but the variance is, naturally, far greater, so it is not the most reliable bankroll builder, IMO

alaskabill · Aug 1, 2011

peedee91 said:
alaskabill, some of the moves that work on pros or better players lower stakes players arent even looking for...lower stakes players are to one dimensional......ex...i show a hand im doin it for a reason not being friendly and letting the table know what i have ....of course no one pays attention to what i am trying to tell them....stuff like that...maybe he needs to move up a level where people are looking for it

Yes lower stakes players are one dimensional, thats why they are easy to beat. You don't need to make any "moves". Just play good starting hands in position, c bet most flops, and value bet your good hands on the turn and river. If the fish suddenly wakes up and fights back fold and move on to the next hand unless you have the nuts. If OP is incapable of doing the basic things needed to beat one dimensional, non thinking players he's not going to beat knowledgeable thinking players.

Here is a link to a post that explains it better than I am apparently.
https://www.cardschat.com/f49/stop-complaining-about-poor-play-your-95121/

fugitive67 · Aug 1, 2011

peedee91 said:
I say try higher stakes...i dont know how you play but i have been told that my game will work well in higher stakes because those players are looking for my moves and playing against it so try higher stakes and see what happens

ha, did a higher stakes Shark tell you this

Kanivision · Aug 10, 2011

well if u want to start a decent bankroll learn the fundamental of stragety and have a good one, really know what cards to play, be patient, and fold 90 percent of the time, and if it look to good to be tru, then u might lose so think twice about playing pocket aces good luck

okiepokerplayer · Feb 26, 2019

peedee91 said:
alaskabill, some of the moves that work on pros or better players lower stakes players arent even looking for...lower stakes players are to one dimensional......ex...i show a hand im doin it for a reason not being friendly and letting the table know what i have ....of course no one pays attention to what i am trying to tell them....stuff like that...maybe he needs to move up a level where people are looking for it

I would have to agree with alaskabill on this topic. If you can't beat the micro stakes, you won't beat the higher stakes. Yes, there is a great deal of variance and bigger number of suckouts at the microstakes because of the way newbies play. But if you stick with basic poker strategy of folding when you're essentially beat by the board, and making the donks pay for their folly, you'll come out way ahead. This also teaches you good poker discipline and the simple fact that board texture is one of the most important aspects of Texas Hold'em.

Tbone461 · Feb 26, 2019

Try moving down a few levels. That usually helps me build both my confidence and bankroll.

chronical · Feb 27, 2019

1. "..combo of all 3.." - no, pick 1 any run with it unteal you ar decent
2. decide what you think is more intersting cash or mtt. if you how with mtt. than i would adivce playing sng s a bit. it's much easier to see were you play bad, oif cash... grind and study =)
GLGL

damgold · Feb 27, 2019

Play many freerolls friend, so you will gain experience in mtts and with the money you win playing freerolls, play tournaments as soon as you earn more money, play more expensive tournaments.

Adi8877 · Feb 27, 2019

Freerolls dont help so much + you gonna be upset quiet often, because of the luck of others, as many crap hands in play.
Play low stack multitable sit&go

Best way to build a bankroll

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