100% agree with this. Trying to fight fire with fire against every hyper-aggressive player just inflates variance and leads to unnecessary swings. Patience usually wins out in the end—if you give them enough rope, they'll almost always hang themselves!nitesss said:
Spot on, especially regarding avoiding unnecessary bluffs. Against a true maniac, your "value" threshold widens significantly because they’ll re-raise or call down with hands a standard player would easily fold. Letting them dictate the aggression while you check-call or flat with top pair/good kicker ends up being such a high-EV line over time.TheniT said:
This isn't a terrible way to play it and offers way less variance if one likes this way and style. The problem and issue I find with this style is someone else often makes the easy money off maniac while the patient one often get's very little to none of it because they refuse to put them shelves in marginal spots against the maniac. The maniac money/chips won't last long because others will adjust and put them shelves in marginal spots against the maniac. I wanna be the first to the maniac's money as it's the easiest and quickest money to make ands take.nitesss said:
This is actually an important point and something, which I have only heard a few poker coaches talk about. The worst players on a cash table, be it maniacs or whales, often have an expiration date on them, because they are often not going to reload, if they get stacked. And for that reason its a bit of a race to get their money, before someone else does.hardongear said:
Yeah it's something almost no one discusses but I noticed really early when I first started playing online poker. Many times I missed out on the easy money sitting back waiting and being patient. I also then as a TAG would always fail to get looser calls against the non-maniac's because it's easy to fold against a TAG player if he's not seen and known to make crazy plays now and again. In the end it was a lose........lose for me.fundiver199 said:
Roller said:
Perfectly put, @hardongear. There is a tangible opportunity cost to being too patient. It’s about recognizing the maximum EV spot at the table and being the first to act on it. Well said!hardongear said:
100% agree. This is also why direct position on the whale is so vital. Being seated on their left lets you widen your isolation range and win that "race" way more efficiently than the rest of the table who are forced to play tighter out of position.fundiver199 said:
That shift from a comfortable TAG style to holding your ground against maniacs is one of the hardest mental hurdles in poker. When you're used to only stacking off with top pair or better, calling down with Ace-high or weak pairs feels unnatural.hardongear said:
That "gather info, then trap" strategy is super satisfying when it hits. Taking a few orbits to study their specific bet sizing and bluff triggers lets you pick the exact spot to let them rope-hang themselves into your value hands!steve01991 said:
Maybe there are some very specific situations, where its ok to call a jam from a maniac with A high on the flop. But I am thinking more about situations like having AJ and getting 3-bet by a maniac with a 50BB stack. Then we should usually just jam it in and not be scared of taking on a high variance spot against a maniac. There are literally no bad outcomes from this:hardongear said:
Spot on, especially regarding stack depth. At 50BB effective, 4-bet jamming AJ against a wide-3-betting maniac is pure profit. Calling their 3-bet creates an awkward SPR post-flop where you end up playing "fit-or-fold" on boards that miss you 66% of the time. Widening your 4-bet value range to include AJ and TT is the exact adjustment needed to punish those 50BB stacks.fundiver199 said:
Spot-on advice! Playing against a true maniac is all about discipline and letting them dig their own grave.sandeeppandekar said:
Exactly. Anonymous tables, fast-fold poker, and mystery bounties cushion their mistakes and hide their HUD stats. It lets them ride high-variance runs much longer before getting exploited by the table.LUKADONCICMVP said:
