Micro FR Study Group

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Fx how many times do I have to tell you that because you can't call with certain hands OOP (and I'm not saying I can) that it means they are unprofitable to do so for everyone. Learn how to play them. Go through different lines you can take, look at every hand you have played this way. For example go through HEM and look at every time you flat called AQ in the blinds to a late position opener and then play them out using the replayer thinking about your opponents ranges and thinking what your best line could be.

Then practice it in game. You'll only get better at playing this spot if you study then practice.

As for 3-bet bluffing, just don't do it at 2nl/5nl and you'll never be making a mistake. No need at this level which is why your stats show what they do. The purpose of 3-bet bluffing is to obv take advantage of someone who folds too much, but it's so we can widen our 3-bet range against opponents who can perceive our 3-bet range. If they call too much and don't think of our hand there's no point. And that's 99.9% of the people you will play at this level.

Also it's no great surprise that 3-betting our top value hands will make the most profit, because we're doing it for value, they're the best hands and we're creating a big pot. Obviously 3-betting 86s will never show as much profit.
 
WSOP13 said:
Full Tilt - $0.05 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

Hero (BB): $5.00
UTG: $6.32
UTG+1: $4.98
MP: $3.43
MP+1: $4.78
LP: $5.00
CO: $5.00
BTN: $2.05
SB: $5.54

SB posts SB $0.02, Hero posts BB $0.05

Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero has A♠ Q♥

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, CO raises to $0.15, fold, fold, Hero calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.32, 2 players) K♥ 5♠ 5♥
Hero checks, CO bets $0.15,


Should we be calling here? Is this like WV TT hand where were ahead of his range and are going to be calling most boards to showdown?
Click to expand...

This is an easy check/raise on the flop
 
Hmm yeah im sometimes a fool for not letting go of my pairs when i should just check fold, i think its the leak lots of us make of calling to reevaluate the next card, but the next card never comes and we just fold to the turn or river.
 
ComplexPlaya said:
This is an easy check/raise on the flop
Click to expand...

Shiiiit maybe thats a huge leak of mine, it wouldnt be an insta check raise from me, maybe i dont check raise enough....? Is there any kind of way to check if we are check raising enough? and maybe what are the optimum conditions to check raise?
 
acky100 said:
Shiiiit maybe thats a huge leak of mine, it wouldnt be an insta check raise from me, maybe i dont check raise enough....? Is there any kind of way to check if we are check raising enough? and maybe what are the optimum conditions to check raise?
Click to expand...
Don't know what the right amount is, my check raise flop % is a little over 12%.
 
JOEBOB69 said:
Don't know what the right amount is, my check raise flop % is a little over 12%.
Click to expand...

How do you find this out on pokertracker? And is this only after they are the pre flop raiser?
 
LuckyChippy said:
Fx how many times do I have to tell you that because you can't call with certain hands OOP (and I'm not saying I can) that it means they are unprofitable to do so for everyone. Learn how to play them. Go through different lines you can take, look at every hand you have played this way. For example go through HEM and look at every time you flat called AQ in the blinds to a late position opener and then play them out using the replayer thinking about your opponents ranges and thinking what your best line could be.

Then practice it in game. You'll only get better at playing this spot if you study then practice.

As for 3-bet bluffing, just don't do it at 2nl/5nl and you'll never be making a mistake. No need at this level which is why your stats show what they do. The purpose of 3-bet bluffing is to obv take advantage of someone who folds too much, but it's so we can widen our 3-bet range against opponents who can perceive our 3-bet range. If they call too much and don't think of our hand there's no point. And that's 99.9% of the people you will play at this level.

Also it's no great surprise that 3-betting our top value hands will make the most profit, because we're doing it for value, they're the best hands and we're creating a big pot. Obviously 3-betting 86s will never show as much profit.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying no one should flat AQ or TT or 99 from the blinds, I should clarify that for a newbie or struggling player it's better to 3bet or fold until they can quickly put someone on a raising range from LP and quickly estimate equity against that range.

Btw, I'm drivng home from Wegman's and I'm thinking about 4betting. Anyone ever calculate over a large sample flatting 3bets with say QQ+/AK vs. 4 betting the same range? By 4betting you fold out a lot of hands you beat but by flatting you get to play against a range you have much better equity against.
 
raise first: won $59.43 - BB/100 - 87.92

called a preflop raise: lost $1.41 - BB/100 - -15.95

3bet: won $18.76 - BB/100 - 330.72

Majority of 2nl and some 5nl but i only have 25k hands total?? wtf i thought i had 3x the amount. So because of the small sample size maybe my losing at called a preflop raise could be variance? My fold to cbet% is probably way too high now that i think about it

Edit: i didn't even see there was a 6th page lol
 
ComplexPlaya said:
This is an easy check/raise on the flop
Click to expand...

really?? i never even think about ch/r here. Could be another leak then. I really don't understand why its an easy ch/r though?
 
It's a good spot to ch/r because he's almost always going to cbet AND he almost never has anything. Paired boards are hard to hit and we certainly have a few kings in our range. If your opponent is actually thinking though he can turn this logic back on you by 3bet/shoving REALLY wide but yeah most of the time a ch/r is going to get a fold.
 
Ya that makes a lot of sense then. I've been missing a ton of opportunities like these in the blinds or from CO or BTN facing preflop raises from MP to LP.

My Fold to F Cbet% positionally from LP:

CO: 74%
BTN: 65%
SB: 76%
BB: 73%
 
Geez. Id never c/r there either. My typical line on boards like that is to call one off and see if they check back the turn. Id try betting out on the river if I think itll work. People are such stations so I avoid spots like that all the time. Im gonna have to give it a try vs the right opponent on dry boards like this.
 
WSOP13 said:
Ya that makes a lot of sense then. I've been missing a ton of opportunities like these in the blinds or from CO or BTN facing preflop raises from MP to LP.

My Fold to F Cbet% positionally from LP:

CO: 74%
BTN: 65%
SB: 76%
BB: 73%
Click to expand...


That is pretty crazy high I would think. How often do you raise a flop c bet?
 
ya i think it's a major leak now.

Overall:

Fold to F Cbet: 71%

Raise F Cbet: 12%
 
WVHillbilly said:
Lol my fold to flop cbet overall is only 37%. Total station ftw.
Click to expand...

Lol mines 34% this month over 2 and 5nl.

I'm such aggro calling station. It's the future.
 
Flop cbet: 71%
Turn cbet: 66%
Fold to F cbet: 34%
Agg: 2.93.

The definition of aggro station.
 
Is there an avg Fold to F cbet% that we should be going for or is too dependent on other things
 
I call lots of c-bets because I usually have a strong hand when I've cold called an open and because players at 2nl/5nl like to c-bet and give up a lot. They're passive and play their hands face up.

I'm sure WV's reasons are different.
 
Haha right whilst we're talking about aggression, ive started using Agg factor instead of frequency and basically i have very little idea of how to interpret this stat or frequency one either.

So ill give a some examples and see what you guys would class the villain as, cause i suck at this stat its pointless me even having it on my hud tbh as i hardly gain anything from it;

18/8/2.5

33/11/3

29/3/2

12/9/3

20/14/4

I hear that it has to do with vpip and pfr stats and also that preflop and postflop are different? is this stat on my hud just for postflop? id always thought it was just postflop, thanks for any help
 
Here's some good info.

When I called a raise with the following hands I lost $ 45.14 for a loss rate of -198.85 BB/100.

AQs
AQo
AJs
AJo
ATs
ATo
KQs
KQo
KJs
KJo
KTs
QJs
QTs
JTs


But when I called with pocket pairs 22-99 my results were $ 21.45 for a winrate of 58.29 BB/100.

Indirectly I really think that the very +EV of set-mining justifies checking single pairs on dry flops.

Also calling raises with drawing hands is a huge leak. Because when I raised first in with these same hands I won $ 22.78 for a win rate of 22.87 BB/100.
 
acky100 said:
Haha right whilst we're talking about aggression, ive started using Agg factor instead of frequency and basically i have very little idea of how to interpret this stat or frequency one either.

So ill give a some examples and see what you guys would class the villain as, cause i suck at this stat its pointless me even having it on my hud tbh as i hardly gain anything from it;

18/8/2.5

33/11/3

29/3/2

12/9/3

20/14/4

I hear that it has to do with vpip and pfr stats and also that preflop and postflop are different? is this stat on my hud just for postflop? id always thought it was just postflop, thanks for any help
Click to expand...



When some one has a high VPIP/PFR and a high AF then they can be considered a maniac because they are playing all their hands aggressively not considering their relative hands strength. Someone with a low VPIP/PFR and a high AF are still agro but they'll have the goods to back it up more often then not.
 
acky100 said:
Shiiiit maybe thats a huge leak of mine, it wouldnt be an insta check raise from me, maybe i dont check raise enough....? Is there any kind of way to check if we are check raising enough? and maybe what are the optimum conditions to check raise?
Click to expand...

WSOP13 said:
really?? i never even think about ch/r here. Could be another leak then. I really don't understand why its an easy ch/r though?
Click to expand...

brank said:
Geez. Id never c/r there either. My typical line on boards like that is to call one off and see if they check back the turn. Id try betting out on the river if I think itll work. People are such stations so I avoid spots like that all the time. Im gonna have to give it a try vs the right opponent on dry boards like this.
Click to expand...

Seeee I told you guys were nits! WV typed what I was too lazy too :icon_thum

WVHillbilly said:
It's a good spot to ch/r because he's almost always going to cbet AND he almost never has anything. Paired boards are hard to hit and we certainly have a few kings in our range. If your opponent is actually thinking though he can turn this logic back on you by 3bet/shoving REALLY wide but yeah most of the time a ch/r is going to get a fold.
Click to expand...
 
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