Future of Online Play

CatchPerfect2 · Feb 26, 2013

Have been following with interest the slow move toward making online poker more available for U.S players. I noticed that Bovada now has anonymous players. Will this render Poker Tracker and similar programs obsolete? Will anonymous player sites become the standard?

absoluthamm · Feb 27, 2013

It renders PT and HEM obsolete on Bovada, but it in no way is hurting them in regards to other sites. The other sites are still doing great, in fact if anything, the anonymous play aspect hurts Bovada because I know many poker players that will not play there because of the stupid concept. Even live poker isn't anonymous...

So the answer to your questions, no and no.

And why would you decide to post this in Tournament Poker of all sections???

steveiam · Feb 27, 2013

I think poker tracking software is part of poker life now.

KerouacsDog · Feb 27, 2013

you're at a loss if you dont have it

Rappyness · Feb 27, 2013

Thats crazy. I will definitely not like it if that comes to Carbon o.o. Its hard enough to get some familiarly with people you play and now they don't want us to know who we are playing with? The heck is that! Hope it doesn't rub off on other US poker sites!

CatchPerfect2 · Feb 27, 2013

Probably for the same reason you say in your Jan 13 blog "I am off to a goo start this year".

I made a mistake

Goathair · Feb 28, 2013

Ace Poker Solutions the people that make Leakbuster put out a HH converter for Bovada that converts the hands into a format you can import into PT or HM. I've been using it for a while now. You just have to download the hands from the site, convert and import into your tracker, and then you will have graphs, stats, and can review your hands, post to forums, etc.

The players still remain anonymous, but just being able to see your stats and review makes playing on Bovada a lot more appealing

RiverOfDreamz · Feb 28, 2013

Bovada (Bodog) has been anonymous for awhile now. No, it has not rubbed off on other US-facing sites (thank goodness). People choose anonymous or not for different reasons. I do play HU at Bovada, but not much else there. I feel like in HU no collusion happens, but at the cash tables and tournaments I think the temptation is too much for those that would not be honest.

kmbpoker · Feb 28, 2013

my concern is still this. if i had a business i would want to do whatever it takes to get every customer possible. Clearly this is costing bovada customers. lots of customers. because of all the reasons every1 mentioned. so why dont they change?? it seems clear to me they are stealing their customers money. other wise they would listen to the public and change to what the players want, not keep what the cheaters want. i do not fear that other sites will follow suit, knowing the players do not want it.

CatchPerfect2 · Feb 28, 2013

Here's my point. poker online is in a state of flux right now with Nevada, Delaware and New Jersey looking to get legislation passed to legalize it. It appears that PokerStars (and others) is to be blocked for 5 years in order to give U.S. based sites a chance to catch up to them in size. Why would Bovada piss customers off and remain anonymous unless there is a long term profit to be realized? If Bovada is using bots, stealing money, etc. it would only destroy their business when the truth came out. I'm wondering if Bovada is running a test program for the U.S.and the U.S. might make it mandatory that all online sites be anonymous. There is alot of tax money at stake for the U.S and state gov'ts and they'll want to make sure everything is in their favor.

kmbpoker · Feb 28, 2013

here is my point. why even have it out there that there is the possibility , yes probability, that this is exactly what they are doing.online poker is not new . the players are used to taking notes and picking there games by who is in them. if they suspect a player is not on the up and up they can note him and avoid him. with their system you cant know you might be cheated until you are, what good is that. THEY ARE LOSING PLAYERS over it what good is that. i smell a rat for sure

wagon596 · Feb 28, 2013

I really like playing on Bovada, I don't feel like sitting a duck,,,more like a moving duck.

Blue_Fossil · Feb 28, 2013

I don't think Bovada is angling for the serious players. They're more interested in the recreational player that anonymity appeals to.

They may change their tune when on-line poker opens up in the US if they feel as if they are losing market share. But in the meantime, they are one of the few games in town and probably don't feel like they are losing anything.

absoluthamm · Feb 28, 2013

The majority of recreational players don't understand that there is a real difference between anonymous play and id'd play.

Blobweird123 · Mar 1, 2013

kmbpoker said:
my concern is still this. if i had a business i would want to do whatever it takes to get every customer possible. Clearly this is costing bovada customers. lots of customers. because of all the reasons every1 mentioned. so why dont they change?? it seems clear to me they are stealing their customers money. other wise they would listen to the public and change to what the players want, not keep what the cheaters want. i do not fear that other sites will follow suit, knowing the players do not want it.

I'm not a huge fan of the anon play at Bovada, though I do play there. BUT it's not really hurting them all that much. They usually have the largest GTD tournies out of any US site and they almost never have any overlay. So I'd say they are doing fine and as long as they are doing fine "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"

tignutz · Mar 1, 2013

I am curious on why ACR doesnt have more players than it has. I have been very satisfied with that site. BoVaDa is good too but would still rather play at ACR

Blobweird123 · Mar 1, 2013

tignutz said:
I am curious on why ACR doesnt have more players than it has. I have been very satisfied with that site. BoVaDa is good too but would still rather play at ACR

For me, its crappy software (lots of issues) and lack of MTT selection. Every tourney they run is Re entry, super long late registration, and generally larger buyins. Doesn't appeal to the masses of micro MTT grinders like myself.

dj11 · Mar 1, 2013

tignutz said:
I am curious on why ACR doesnt have more players than it has. I have been very satisfied with that site. BoVaDa is good too but would still rather play at ACR

Tho it has an appealing interface, the software does weird things, and the game selection is weak. We who do play there, are hoping a promised software upgrade will fix things.

Blobweird123 · Mar 1, 2013

dj11 said:
Tho it has an appealing interface, the software does weird things, and the game selection is weak. We who do play there, are hoping a promised software upgrade will fix things.

Yeah if they fix the weird glitches (Addon not happening, double big blinds, sattys pointing to wrong tournies to name a few) and up the micro selection alot. Throw in some freezeouts as well. Then I will gladly move my whole roll there and love it!

caintain · Mar 1, 2013

yeah i play at bovada and at first liked the anonymity but its too easy to cheat.
i've noticed on some cash tables more than one person leaving at the same time which is really sketch
I really wish FT open for US players but that's prolly never coming back

absoluthamm · Mar 1, 2013

caintain said:
yeah i play at bovada and at first liked the anonymity but its too easy to cheat.
i've noticed on some cash tables more than one person leaving at the same time which is really sketch
I really wish FT open for US players but that's prolly never coming back

Anonymous does not make it ANY easier to cheat, and I can assure you, the sites themselves can tell if there is collusion going on just as well regardless of if the players are anonymous to each other, they aren't anonymous to the sites. Just because multiple people leave at the same time in no way shows that there is cheating going on. Even if it did, how would it be any different than then thousands of times I have seen that on FullTilt/Stars/BCP/etc and know for a fact those players are not cheaters?

That post was just a couple words away from being nominated rigtard.

Blobweird123 · Mar 1, 2013

caintain said:
yeah i play at bovada and at first liked the anonymity but its too easy to cheat.
i've noticed on some cash tables more than one person leaving at the same time which is really sketch
I really wish FT open for US players but that's prolly never coming back

It's not even the cheating aspect for me. It's not being able to collect ANY history on villains. One day you could be playing isildur1 and the next you're playing my grandmother lol. But you have to see a good 100 hands before you can get a read, and then POOF! They get up and leave/switch tables.

pfb8888 · Mar 2, 2013

Blobweird123 said:
It's not even the cheating aspect for me. It's not being able to collect ANY history on villains. One day you could be playing isildur1 and the next you're playing my grandmother lol. But you have to see a good 100 hands before you can get a read, and then POOF! They get up and leave/switch tables.

thats the true beauty of POKER ! tracking software kills the mystery..and most of the challenge

maybe thats why poker is dying ...oversaturated analyzation

bovada anonymous will be the future ... RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

dj11 · Mar 2, 2013

pfb8888 said:
...oversaturated analyzation

Blobweird123 · Mar 2, 2013

pfb8888 said:
thats the true beauty of POKER ! tracking software kills the mystery..and most of the challenge

maybe thats why poker is dying ...oversaturated analyzation

bovada anonymous will be the future ... RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

Couldn't disagree more. Being able to learn your opponents through history has ALWAYS been a part of poker, live or online. That won't change. Bovada is on its own there and probably will remain that way.

If i've seen you 5bet 50 times and you've ONLY shown down with AA, then its safe to say when you just 5bet me that you have AA and im dominated. This can happen in live just as easily if you're attentive to detail and have a good memory. So you wouldn't use that to your advantage? You'd rather just go in blind every hand and never have a range for villain? Flawed thinking...

Future of Online Play

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