Should hands be shown at all showdowns?

DonSifu · Feb 3, 2015

Here is a good topic of discussion: do you think that all hands should be exposed at showdown? The TDA rules state that all hands must be shown down when two or more players are All In, but what about when players still have chips?
The 'all in showdown' rule is in effect so as to prevent collusion, so with that same logic, i think all hands should be shown down at the river. What if my buddy is playing at the same table, and i check call him down to the river with the nuts, only to fold at the river when he tables two pair? Shouldn't i be required to show my hand?
Of course I'm only talking about tournament poker here, and I'd love to hear your opinions. Please discuss!

army-ninja · Feb 5, 2015

No.. ONly time anyone should be required to show a hand is the player who bet last. Player who bet last shows and other player can muck

DonSifu · Feb 6, 2015

army-ninja said:
No.. ONly time anyone should be required to show a hand is the player who bet last. Player who bet last shows and other player can muck

i know this is the current rule, but by allowing the player to muck and not show their hand, it sets up a possible collusion angle.
example: let's say you and i are buddies, and we end up at the same table in a MTT deepstack tourney. I'm sitting on well over 100 BBs, and you have like 13 BBs. We get in a hand together, and I check call all the way to the river, holding the nuts, but when you table your top two pair, i just muck the winner just so you can get some chips.
I've never seen this, and I'm a firm believer that 'there are no friends at the poker table', i'm simpling asking for the sake of discussion.

OzExorcist · Feb 6, 2015

DonSifu said:
i know this is the current rule, but by allowing the player to muck and not show their hand, it sets up a possible collusion angle.

You're forgetting an important part of the rules though: if the hand has gone to showdown, ANY player who was dealt cards is entitled to see the contents of a mucked hand.

So if players suspect you of colluding, they can insist on seeing your hand to confirm it.

hffjd2000 · Feb 6, 2015

I think player/s can request to the dealer to see the muck hand.

They have the right to do so but for poker etiquette sake, dont do it everytime. Mostly done on those crucial or interesting hands.

VizziVizo · Feb 7, 2015

Yes, sometimes when you want to lie your opponents about your game style.

army-ninja · Feb 8, 2015

There is no way to ask for a player to show mucked hands in online poker...

OzExorcist · Feb 8, 2015

army-ninja said:
There is no way to ask for a player to show mucked hands in online poker...

That depends entirely on the software. But generally speaking if a hand has gone to showdown you just bring up the "last hand" window and it'll show the cards.

jimmy62 · Feb 10, 2015

I think the rules state that only the person called must show their hand unless other person in hand accidentally or on purpose turns one over.In that case any one in that hand can request to see all of that persons cards.

OzExorcist · Feb 10, 2015

jimmy62 said:
I think the rules state that only the person called must show their hand unless other person in hand accidentally or on purpose turns one over.In that case any one in that hand can request to see all of that persons cards.

Nope, the rule is that anyone who was dealt cards in the hand (even if they folded preflop and never put any money in) is entitled to see the contents of any hand that goes to showdown.

As a matter of etiquette players generally don't invoke that rule, but it still stands.

DonSifu · Feb 12, 2015

OzExorcist said:
You're forgetting an important part of the rules though: if the hand has gone to showdown, ANY player who was dealt cards is entitled to see the contents of a mucked hand.

So if players suspect you of colluding, they can insist on seeing your hand to confirm it.

this is absolutely true! good point sir.

jjjones · Feb 12, 2015

I dont think so

In my opinion if a player wants to simply give up a hand after being called--assuming a stone cold bluff, I feel AS THOUGH IT WOULD BE pretty obvious as to what their cards are, so i have no objection to he loser trying to preserve an image, it also creates a neat oppertunity for players to look like they're bluffing and muck very strong hands that simply weren't the best.

jjjones · Feb 12, 2015

DonSifu said:
this is absolutely true! good point sir.

I agree, however in high stakes games, and in low stakes games, colluding is rare and often attempts fail.

guicor30 · Feb 13, 2015

I've noticed that in PS but not display the villain put his hand when the hand will repeat if I can see your hands.
this also happens to you?

DonSifu · Feb 20, 2015

i work in a small casino where several couples tend to play on the same tables, so we keep a sharp eye out for any attempts at collusion. what i've discovered however is that the old saying is true; there are no friends in poker. Often times these couples try very aggressively to knock each other out, mostly for bragging rights i suppose.

arizoney · Feb 21, 2015

if im the last person to call a bet in the game i have the right to see the cards of the player before me that made the bet and do not have to show my cards unless i can beat the bettor. so with this said on some poker sites i find its not this way at all. so goes just another thing that makes me go hmmm and i wonder wtf how does the house have the right to see the cards and the players dont. one more thing about online poker that makes it look like not true poker. now its not every site but a few sites still do this.

alittlepoker · Feb 21, 2015

I think there are two rules regarding the sho down and has somthing to do with the betting of coarse

OzExorcist · Feb 21, 2015

arizoney said:
if im the last person to call a bet in the game i have the right to see the cards of the player before me that made the bet and do not have to show my cards unless i can beat the bettor. so with this said on some poker sites i find its not this way at all. so goes just another thing that makes me go hmmm and i wonder wtf how does the house have the right to see the cards and the players dont. one more thing about online poker that makes it look like not true poker. now its not every site but a few sites still do this.

Oh dear...

No, you don't have to show your cards if you can't beat the bettor, but everyone who was dealt into the hand (even if they folded preflop) has the right to see your hand if they want to.

That's the rule for live poker, online sites who let people see your hand after showdown are just reflecting that rule.

Should hands be shown at all showdowns?

DonSifu

Enthusiast

army-ninja

Rock Star

DonSifu

Enthusiast

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle

hffjd2000

Legend

VizziVizo

Visionary

army-ninja

Rock Star

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle

jimmy62

Enthusiast

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle

DonSifu

Enthusiast

jjjones

Rising Star

jjjones

Rising Star

guicor30

Visionary

DonSifu

Enthusiast

arizoney

Rock Star

alittlepoker

Rock Star

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle

About CardsChat

Our Community

Our Site