Whether to use a card protector

NOLA Red · Jun 6, 2010

The importance of protecting your cards is greater if you are seated in seat 1 or 9 (10). Sitting right next to the dealer seems to be the prime spot for unintentional mucking. I ALWAYS protect my cards if sitting in one of these two seats.

Dealers have to stretch a bit to get to the other seats and you can usually stop them before they grab them. If seated in any other position, I randomly use a chip, place my hand on my cards or hold them parallel to the felt. Occasionally I'll use a chip protector, usually my tiny green Buddha

, when playing $4/8 FLHE where you don't have to worry about looking lame.

Weregoat · Jun 9, 2010

Once I get back from Iraq I'll be using my deployment coin as my card protecter. For the time being I hold my cards in my left hand until action is on me. Once I see my cards I immediately know whether or not I want to play them, so the next question is how. Once I'm sure they're memorized I put them face down on the felt, take a small chip off my small stack, and place it over the cards.

It's exactly the same every time, and is especially helpful when you're in seat one, as the mucked hands have a tendancy to slide into your hand on occaison.

I've never had an issue with a hand being mucked because my cards weren't protected, but once all my chips are in, my cards are back in my left hand.

clint_jacobs · Jun 10, 2010

Well, whether or not you are using a card protector, it is a very good practice to memorize your cards and just stay put with no unnecessary movements, in order that your opponents can't read your moves. But to make things more safe, it is really good to use a card protector. A number of things can act as one, like a single chip, coin, etc.

greywind50 · Jun 11, 2010

always put a chip over your cards....think of it as insurance. You might not need it but the one time you do, it's worth the effort.

clubsta · Jun 11, 2010

Ah man, that wsop video is rough. Good for her for keeping it together . . . I would have flipped out.

I saw this one guy playing live who had this really awesome holographic pog slammer for a card protector. Ever since I saw that, I've been looking for a protector that I like. Currently seeking out a mini spinning roulette table protector, but that would probably distract me too much, haha (and possibly turn into a tell when I play with it).

Grossberger · Jun 11, 2010

YES YES YES YES YES YES .................AND YES always use some kinda of card protector. We had a home game situation happen guy goes all in and gets 2 callers who have him covered flop comes A J 10 rainbow the 2 players still with chips create a side pot turn is a 2 goes check check river brings another 2 one guy bets the other pushes and gets snap called so the side pot is determined first and the guy that pushed flopped the nut straight the caller had pocket 10's then when they went to see what the all in guy had his cards were not in front of him and he was pissed he sadi he folded JJ and 2 jacks were found in the discard pile together but his hand was dead.

CntryBoys · Jun 11, 2010

Im not a big fan of the card protectors. No one can obviously see your cards when they are face down anyways.

Grossberger · Jun 11, 2010

CntryBoys said:
Im not a big fan of the card protectors. No one can obviously see your cards when they are face down anyways.

they are not to keep people from seeing your cards it so they dont get taken away by accident or have cards mucked into them.

5TR8 FLUSH · Jun 11, 2010

"Stick66" great example, and nice chip. I remember when I saw that lady go all in and lose, I felt so bad for her I'm surprised she didn't cry or punched the dealer. LOL

sportserh · Jun 13, 2010

I do. Better safe then sorry. Just be careful not to give your hand away!

ghughes · Jun 14, 2010

I wouldn't worry about a tell because you're using a card protector. Better tells are playing with your cards unconsciously, a finger twitch (idio-motor), pupil dilation, lip swelling, facial skin tone, asymmetrical facial movement, pulse quickening (read at the wrist or carotid artery), breathing, etc.

The unconscious tells are much more reliable and much harder to fake or conceal.

pat3392 · Jun 17, 2010

Ok I've been getting in the routine of using a card protector. What I've been doing is holding my cards in one hand once they are dealt to them; sort of more "lifting" them to the side slightly, as if I'm just about to pick them up and look at them if that makes sense. After I check out the other players a bit then I look at my cards and place the card protector over.

My question is: is having my cards slightly "tilted/lifted" alright? As in the dealer can't muck them for whatever reason? If someone flicks there cards towards mine I could quickly pull mine backwards but I'm not sure if that's ok.

eberetta1 · Jun 18, 2010

I do not use a card protector. I know to keep my cards a certain distance near the rail to not get them mucked and to push them away when I want to muck. It is annoying, just another annoyance, like people who feel the need to wear sunglasses when playing cards. Just another item to lose, or fidget with to reduce stress. IMHO.

Weregoat · Jun 21, 2010

ghughes said:
I wouldn't worry about a tell because you're using a card protector. Better tells are playing with your cards unconsciously, a finger twitch (idio-motor), pupil dilation, lip swelling, facial skin tone, asymmetrical facial movement, pulse quickening (read at the wrist or carotid artery), breathing, etc.

The unconscious tells are much more reliable and much harder to fake or conceal.

Letting villain take your pulse while in a hand is -EV.

And some people are abnormally tachy or bradycardic, so somebody who runs 15 miles a week and just woke up and is still sleepy might have a resting heart rate lower than 45 (my personal lowest), I hear Lance Armstrong's resting heartrate is in the low thirties... so while the normal range is between 60-100 for an adult, an escalation of 30-40% of somebody could fall in the normal range. And even if you do have your opponent on a pulse oxymeter (displays % of O2 in blood and your pulse, sits on your fingertip), you could have an escalated heart rate from a number of factors at the poker table, not limited to but including bluffing, having a monster hand, the porn on the TV behind you, loving poker, laughter, a recent cigarrette, being in a fight, or incoming mortars (however the incoming mortars is pretty much not a threat in such large casinos... Plus, who shoots mortars at a casino?)

There are a myriad of tells, and if you have excellent vision and excellent attention to detail, I'm sure you can pick up on more of them than most, however, the average player I'm sure will have to go more off of villain's actions and the story he tells.

rugby0 · Jun 21, 2010

I use a card protector for two reasons. 1. To keep my cards until i wish too muck them. @. To remind me to menorize my cards. I use a tiny anvil brass weight about 2.5 0z.

Weregoat · Jun 21, 2010

rugby0 said:
I use a card protector for two reasons. 1. To keep my cards until i wish too muck them. @. To remind me to menorize my cards. I use a tiny anvil brass weight about 2.5 0z.

Yep.

I'm supposed to get a coin for this deployment I'm on.

I'll be using that as my card protecter in the WSOP ME in 2011.

ShaneD · Jun 22, 2010

That video is sick? Is it really Raymond Domenech's wife? If so then its not so bad

Trimming1 · Jun 22, 2010

Mortis said:
Next time, she should just bring a meat cleaver to the table and if the dealer's hand should come close to her cards, then take a swipe.

I call that "protecting your cards".

Back to that video.... yes, she should have protected her cards, but that doesn't make up for the dealer being incompetent. She was obviously all-in and her cards were right in front of her... the dealer just reached behind her chips and grabbed her cards, which were plainly in front of her. The dealer was a complete moron..... so with that, I have to say, protect your cards from stupid dealers. Some aren't paying attention.. or have been dealing at the table for awhile, and may get sidetracked from being tired.... do something to make sure that your cards don't get accidentally mucked.

I deal live tournement poker and it truly is the players responsibility to protect thier hand. PERIOD!! That dealer in the video clearly made an error but yOu try dealing 8 plus hrs straight, YOU WILL MAKE MISTAKES.i SEE ALL kinds of mistakes by players but misdeal just one hand and now your a no dealin MF.

Weregoat · Jun 22, 2010

Trimming1 said:
I deal live tournement poker and it truly is the players responsibility to protect thier hand. PERIOD!! That dealer in the video clearly made an error but yOu try dealing 8 plus hrs straight, YOU WILL MAKE MISTAKES.i SEE ALL kinds of mistakes by players but misdeal just one hand and now your a no dealin MF.

Just for that I'm not tipping the dealer at the next game I play.

Poker Orifice · Jul 26, 2010

Weregoat said:
Letting villain take your pulse while in a hand is -EV.

And some people are abnormally tachy or bradycardic, so somebody who runs 15 miles a week and just woke up and is still sleepy might have a resting heart rate lower than 45 (my personal lowest), I hear Lance Armstrong's resting heartrate is in the low thirties... so while the normal range is between 60-100 for an adult, an escalation of 30-40% of somebody could fall in the normal range. And even if you do have your opponent on a pulse oxymeter (displays % of O2 in blood and your pulse, sits on your fingertip), you could have an escalated heart rate from a number of factors at the poker table, not limited to but including bluffing, having a monster hand, the porn on the TV behind you, loving poker, laughter, a recent cigarrette, being in a fight, or incoming mortars (however the incoming mortars is pretty much not a threat in such large casinos... Plus, who shoots mortars at a casino?)

There are a myriad of tells, and if you have excellent vision and excellent attention to detail, I'm sure you can pick up on more of them than most, however, the average player I'm sure will have to go more off of villain's actions and the story he tells.

Your response here sounds like you're insinuating that this isn't a decent tell to go by? I don't think they said it's etched in stone, just another of many to consider. Why do you think so many players wear hoodies & scarves? a fashion statement?

Toast · Jul 26, 2010

Stick66 said:
Some people say "Card protectors are lame. Just use a chip." But what it you go all-in and have no chip?

YouTube- WSOP 2009 - AA preflop in to the muck (dead hand)

As I've never played live poker I didn't knew about this ruling of protecting cards, I thought to muck/fold you would just push them away from you face down, but from watching that video it was sick ... and in the WSOP to boot. Just wondering can you anything as a card protector?

only_bridge · Jul 26, 2010

In the WSOPME very few people used card protectors. On several occations I saw the dealer taking one of the chips from a players stack and put it on top of that players cards.
(some players were very careless with their cards and placed them in front of their gigant stack and then just leaned back and listened to music whilst the flop was dealt. In the hand they were in!)

nevadanick · Jul 26, 2010

Toast said:
As I've never played live poker I didn't knew about this ruling of protecting cards, I thought to muck/fold you would just push them away from you face down, but from watching that video it was sick ... and in the WSOP to boot. Just wondering can you anything as a card protector?

Just about anything can be used as a card protector. Only restrictions I've ever seen is nothing larger than the cards themselves (so the cards can't be completely covered and out of sight), nothing than is sharp that could mark or damage the surface of the card/s and nothing that could leave a liquid trail or trace of any kind. No sweating drink glasses, coffee cups, shot glasses, cue stick chalk cube, etc.

aliengenius · Jul 26, 2010

Some pros mock card protectors, lol.

Quackpot · Jul 26, 2010

Always protect your cards. Whether it's with a chip, card protector, or your hand. Just about every player has had, or knows someone who has had their hand mucked because of a over zealous dealer or an errant muck of someones hand.

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