Why do most players lose overall?

Yea, that's basically the problem, you are going to trade alot of pots back and forth, (especially against competent opponenets) eating into the total money at the table. As Belgo posted, he has won 200k+ in pots and lost 200k+ in pots this year while winning 12k (and that's with a good winrate)

Even though the % rake is higher at micro, its not too bad as its much easier to get in way ahead in your biggest pots. I've heard the rake is the hardest on players playing ~50NL, where max winrates start to settle down and not that many pots are capped.

Poker skill is alot like driving...most people surveyed think they are good drivers, the reality of the situation is only about 20% of Americans are good drivers....about the same %, probably a bit less are good poker players...when you think you're good at something its not likely you're going to try and change it...they don't realize their losing because they suck its always the donkey, the cards blah blah blah, in reality they need to look in the mirror or the guy/gal's sunglasses across the table.

playing to many hands

i have lost a lot of money because i play to many hands. expecialy after loseing a big hand

Of course all these reasons play a good part in certain percentages of why most ppl dont make money playing poker. But in my opinion most ppl loose money in simple ways. Understanding how the rakes work on whatever site your playing on is obviously a pretty big deal regarding how you play your hands at the cash tables(need to watch that). Also lots of ppl spend way to much rebuying back into tourneys over and over again after the field has had time to build a stack large enough to bully them out of their money or into playing a hand they really dont want to play. And of course a lot of ppl play in tourneys with larger buyins than they can really afford. For instance if someone deposits twenty bucks on a site they really shouldnt be rolling into tourneys with a buyin over three bucks. The odds of placing in good money are much better with one or two dollar buyins and more tourneys.(Just my opinion). Not to mention the ppl that like to sit down at cash tables and play games they really dont understand or have a strategy for like they think they do and get eaten alive by ppl that really know what they are doing. Any ways thats my take on most of it. =]

i beg to differ i belive its because most people play out of there depths, move up the chain too fast and generally think they are alot better than they really are rake is irrelavent. ego is the real key to it all.

How about all the above.
Bad players playing too many hands at too high of a buy-in and when they do get lucky and catch the river card they then have to pay the rake.

It's a toss up between bankroll management and the fact that the idiots go all in first hand with A rag because they got an ace so they must win.

i think we already said that the reason is rake

Bad BR management
Bad skills
Bad timing
RAKE
Big Ego

losts0ul said:

Bad BR management
Bad skills
Bad timing
RAKE
Big Ego

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Basically they suck at poker!

5% of people lose because of the rake. 27% of players are winning players that would be 33% if there was no rake. This is according to sharkscope so cash games maybe different. I think the biggest reason people lose is they don't know enough about the game. It takes work to become a winning player. You don't just play play play and then when you've played enough you become a winning player. This is not a game where practice make perfect. It takes lots of study and review of our game. You got to know when the right time to make adjustments and just what the correct adjustments are. This is a learned process not through just experience alone. It's lots of work to become a winner and the majority of the poker playing population don't put in the effort.

I believe the majority of players loosing while playing poker do so as a direct result of a considerable lack of patients. At least I know this has been my issue in the past. As a result, I don’t play unless I know I have the time allocated and possess the composed, tranquil mindset I for one require, for success.

Bigsmak said:

I will go with Bad Bankroll management.

Thats why I kept losing everything.. I played really well then found myself putting 40% of all my cash on 1 table and losing it all... Bad beat or not I should not have been in the position!

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And on top of all that you have somebody calling you while hes dominated and hitting a 3 outter......over and over again.....your a 70-80% favourite on 20 hands but the DONK3Y with the 3 outter wins 18 of those hands

I lose because I always get way to drunk to really use my skill.
That is the only reason for me losing other than the typical suckouts that occur.
Other than them two reasons I am sound as pound baby.....

i think its because stupid fn morons dont fold when they should!

i think biggest reason is gambling in bad spots, dont using good bankroll management, dunno about rake but its not biggest reason of all. always you want to get your bankroll up very fast.. you play in wrong tables(wrong buyins) and mybe play not good enough!

Lack of patience; overvaluing their hands; inability to read board; inability to read opponents; improper bet sizing (can't maximize wins/minimize losses)

Too many starting hands and the rake are probably the two biggest reasons....I can't tell you how often I see showdowns in 1-2 NL games with people who played 6-3 or 9-4 offsuit in early or mid position...even if its for 2$ what in the hell are you trying to accomplish by playing these hands...you watch some of these shows like high stakes poker or poker after dark and you see players folding A-10 to small raises....yet these guys...and gals simply just dont get it...to me too many starting hands is the #1 way to lose when you get to table other than being intoxicated or high.

FatBasset said:

Lack of patience; overvaluing their hands; inability to read board; inability to read opponents; improper bet sizing (can't maximize wins/minimize losses)

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That was so well said and all very good and strong valid points the only thing I might add is that along with inpatience pure old tiredness and exhaustion might also factor in I have been late in tourneys before and got tired and misread hands and what was out on the table both.:deal:

regd87 said:

rakeback ftw.

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You must have a really bad deal then....

Because most never do their homework before or after a session. They just do not put in the time or effort. They get a rush winning that big pot, (THEY HAD NO REASON WINNING) then loose it back, and tell lies to others how well they did. They are our life blood and we need to keep them around.

Group One: Big Losers. I'd guess that 60% of players lose money because they do not play well. Half of them think they play well, and it's just luck/rigged sites/donks that keep them from winning a lot. (Some days they kill, and those days, though rare, make them misevaluate their skill level.) Every lost hand threatens their equilibrium, and they are prone to tilting off their bankrolls.

Group Two: Medium Losers. Another 25% lose money because, although they have moderate skills that make them feel somewhat comfortable, they lose control of their emotions periodically and go on tilt. Perhaps they have other mindset issues-- too conservative, too risk-taking or risk-adverse. Combine this with shaky bankroll management, and they lose. They don't lose as quickly nor as definitively as Group One. OK, that accounts for 85% of players.

Group Three: Sometimes Losers. Then there is another 5% (or more) that would break even, if not for the rake. They are very close to being winners overall, and some months they are winners. Their skills are good, they have found a game/level that they can win at with comfort, they are bankrolled sufficiently for it, and they keep themselves under control. But variances and their minor leaks are competing with the rake. They have difficulty staying ahead.

Group Four: Winners. Nobody wins all the time. These folks tend to stay ahead. Sometimes they, too, go broke. But mostly, their egos are left at the door, and they move down when they need to. Their bankroll is never put completely at risk, and they play well enough to build it back up after a bad period. Rake is factored in as a cost of play.

I made up the percentages. But I think that may be a decent ballpark.

bad bankroll management and not being able to get away from hands when they know they are beat

cheers and gl
wooter

Rake is a cost of playing poker. if you have PTR or HEM you can see it adds up to be a lot of money. To be a winning player yo have to earn more money than it costs to 'pay' the rake in the long run. If you can't do this you are a losing player, and trust me it is hard. You have to beat opponents to pay the rake, and that is the reason people lose, they just don't win enough.

Why do they lose?

Pride...Greed...and Hubris!