whew u scared me for a minute... Thot u meant they were banning the software for games u r playing. I dont mind them stopping data mining of tables and games you are not sitting in... that is rather piggy datawise and borderline unethical.
Looks as though they have reversed their decision. From OPR
PokerStars on OPR
Recent coverage changes - April 2009
PokerStars recently changed the results display of certain SNG tournaments (27,180-360). Players that did not participate in the tournament can no longer view the results. Instead of listing the players in the result box, they display the following message, "Additional tournament information is available to the tournament participants only"
This has eliminated our ability to collect the results for these SNG tournaments.
We expect PokerStars to extend this to all regular SNG's in the near future if they don't decide to reverse their decision and we encourage you to write an email to PokerStars ([email protected]) and kindly ask them to reverse their decision if you want your PokerStars tournaments tracked by OPR.
Please don't email OPR about the missing PokerStars SNG tournaments as we do not add them manually.
See the coverage page for what tournaments we track in general.
14th of April 2009:
PokerStars has (for now) reversed their decision and we are able to track the missing (27,180-360) SNG tourneys again.
PokerStars on OPR
Recent coverage changes - April 2009
PokerStars recently changed the results display of certain SNG tournaments (27,180-360). Players that did not participate in the tournament can no longer view the results. Instead of listing the players in the result box, they display the following message, "Additional tournament information is available to the tournament participants only"
This has eliminated our ability to collect the results for these SNG tournaments.
We expect PokerStars to extend this to all regular SNG's in the near future if they don't decide to reverse their decision and we encourage you to write an email to PokerStars ([email protected]) and kindly ask them to reverse their decision if you want your PokerStars tournaments tracked by OPR.
Please don't email OPR about the missing PokerStars SNG tournaments as we do not add them manually.
See the coverage page for what tournaments we track in general.
14th of April 2009:
PokerStars has (for now) reversed their decision and we are able to track the missing (27,180-360) SNG tourneys again.
It's a good move in general.
How else are you going stop the unfair advantage.
These programs are making money out of old rope!!!
Information that should be kept private to the players on the table or in the tourney should stay that way.
How else are you going stop the unfair advantage.
These programs are making money out of old rope!!!
Information that should be kept private to the players on the table or in the tourney should stay that way.
tenbob said:
I haven't been playing online for very long but I was quite shocked when I was in a PokerStars MTT a few days ago where one guy was spewing out numbers for how much everyone was up or down at the table and how long it had been since they cashed etc. I personally think only the people involved in the tournament should have access to this information. I hope this feature is brought back soon and taken up by other sites.
From a very selfish POV, I was aghast when I first learned about all things trackers. PokerTracker even bugged the living shit out of me at first. And data mining sites seemed way too intrusive. That was 3 years (or more) ago, and I now use, and depend on PT. PT is a first level tracker, doing what I should do, but didn't because it was a pain in the butt.
2nd level 'Data mining' is just a collective effort along the same lines. As presented by OPR, sharkscope, bluff and others it really is not much different than the Sports section league standings for any game you follow. Baseball, Football, Hockey, Basketball, even Alpine skiing and snowboarding (caveat to follow). But you will notice those are all team sports.
3rd level trackers would be the collective stat exchange that every site has banned.
As for public posting of results, or in the 2nd level case, the private posting of public results;
You won't find quite the same depth for individual sports. Tennis, Golf, Bowling, etc. Skiing is an exception, tho a minor one. Individuals are listed, but the team gets most of the honor, while the individuals win the cash.
The poker sites want something akin to the Skiiers. They want the best to be playing (promoting) such and such a site. So they sort of have to leave results available for general review. It is in the best interests of everyone that everyone can know as much about who they are playing against.
Some of the obvious workarounds turn out to be worse than Stars original solution of limited access. Bots or sitouts come to mind. And larger fees to access the results. So for example, ITPR (I Track Poker Results {fictional}) charges a fee to get the results, and that fee is used to enter bots or sitouts into tourneys just to get results.
Worse might be that ITPR, contacts severely losing players and offers staking just to get the results. Losing players with gambling problems would be tickled to get a rake back for some very small percentage of their losings. Ex; Donkfish plays 10 losers in a row and gets a 'rakeback' of 1 buy-in in exchange for the tourney results from all 10.
So public posting of the results is better than secretive BS.
IMO.
I have always thought that the best way for sites to combat this would be for every player to have access to every other players stats via software provided for by the sites. So at any time, just like we look at our own stats, we could look at the pother players stats at that table at that moment. This would allow the sites to control the historic aspect of established datamineing sites.
2nd level 'Data mining' is just a collective effort along the same lines. As presented by OPR, sharkscope, bluff and others it really is not much different than the Sports section league standings for any game you follow. Baseball, Football, Hockey, Basketball, even Alpine skiing and snowboarding (caveat to follow). But you will notice those are all team sports.
3rd level trackers would be the collective stat exchange that every site has banned.
As for public posting of results, or in the 2nd level case, the private posting of public results;
You won't find quite the same depth for individual sports. Tennis, Golf, Bowling, etc. Skiing is an exception, tho a minor one. Individuals are listed, but the team gets most of the honor, while the individuals win the cash.
The poker sites want something akin to the Skiiers. They want the best to be playing (promoting) such and such a site. So they sort of have to leave results available for general review. It is in the best interests of everyone that everyone can know as much about who they are playing against.
Some of the obvious workarounds turn out to be worse than Stars original solution of limited access. Bots or sitouts come to mind. And larger fees to access the results. So for example, ITPR (I Track Poker Results {fictional}) charges a fee to get the results, and that fee is used to enter bots or sitouts into tourneys just to get results.
Worse might be that ITPR, contacts severely losing players and offers staking just to get the results. Losing players with gambling problems would be tickled to get a rake back for some very small percentage of their losings. Ex; Donkfish plays 10 losers in a row and gets a 'rakeback' of 1 buy-in in exchange for the tourney results from all 10.
So public posting of the results is better than secretive BS.
IMO.
I have always thought that the best way for sites to combat this would be for every player to have access to every other players stats via software provided for by the sites. So at any time, just like we look at our own stats, we could look at the pother players stats at that table at that moment. This would allow the sites to control the historic aspect of established datamineing sites.
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MDTed said:
Tend to agree with this post, even though I have looked at 3rd party software. Found on one tracker that the information provided was incorrect. So what good is this. Also compared my stats on two different datamining sites and my ratings were completely different, even though the sites were almost identical. So what good is this. If the poker sites want to provide data on players in addition to hand histories so be it, but 3rd party sites should not be allowed to collect this data.