Building from a baby bankroll

[intiekkeko]

Well wow

some great advice there and as one of those just starting on the poker journey a lot of useful tips on how to keep a bankroll going

I will definately try and put as much of this into practice as possible

thx again

inti

 

[okeedokalee]

I agree Oz STTs are better value than MTTs.

Any comments on increasing the STT's return by multi-tabling them

 

[OzExorcist]

Provided the additional tables don't adversely affect your game (eg: you're six-tabling and losing in a game you'd otherwise be winning if you were playing one or two tables) then definitely multi-table. You'll make a better $/hr figure and progress much more quickly.

We have to walk before we can run though - if there are people that aren't sure if they're even beating one table at a time, multi-tabling would be disastrous. That goes for STTs and cash games as well.

 

[Chemist]

Congrats - you caught the upside of variance.

But I really don't think there's any debate to be had on this point: MTTs are about as high-variance as poker games come. Is anyone actually disputing that?

This isn't some personal jihad against MTTs on my part or anything and I'm certainly not looking to insult the people that play them. I'm just pointing out the fact that they're very high variance, and very high variance is very bad for us if we're trying to turn, say $20 or less into a proper bankroll. For every person that catches the upside like you did there will be dozens that will end up broke and having to start from scratch.

PERHAPS there is one point to add to your excellent advice.
Reading this reply made me think that this is possibly even the most important aspect.
Here you say 'Congrats - you caught the upside of variance'.
and you have a section titled 'You Have To Get Lucky' but it doesn't mention managing your luck.
Everyone has heard of BRM, but not very much is written on VLM (Variance Luck Management) perhaps because I just invented it.
How many times have you heard of people building a bankroll only to lose it all in a massive downswing period?

PRACTICE GOOD VLM
During bad VLM don't risk your bankroll on anything.
During good VLM maybe have a go at an MTT.

variance and luck are clearly not measurable but most people are aware if they are on a winning, losing, or regular streak. Recognising and managing bankroll usage with VLM could help bank roll building and avoid bankroll loss.

 

[OzExorcist]

*raises eyebrows*

So... basically you're saying don't play when you're on a losing streak and gamboool when you're on a hot streak?

Sorry but I'm pretty sure there's no way to "manage" luck.

 

[madtom1337]

PERHAPS there is one point to add to your excellent advice.
Reading this reply made me think that this is possibly even the most important aspect.
Here you say 'Congrats - you caught the upside of variance'.
and you have a section titled 'You Have To Get Lucky' but it doesn't mention managing your luck.
Everyone has heard of BRM, but not very much is written on VLM (Variance Luck Management) perhaps because I just invented it.
How many times have you heard of people building a bankroll only to lose it all in a massive downswing period?

PRACTICE GOOD VLM
During bad VLM don't risk your bankroll on anything.
During good VLM maybe have a go at an MTT.

variance and luck are clearly not measurable but most people are aware if they are on a winning, losing, or regular streak. Recognising and managing bankroll usage with VLM could help bank roll building and avoid bankroll loss.

lollilols.

Variance is like a roulette wheel. There will be streaks of reds, streaks of blacks, highs, lows, etc. etc. - but just cuz there's 15 blacks in a row doesn't mean the chance of there being a red isn't still 50/50.

 

[Poker Orifice]

PERHAPS there is one point to add to your excellent advice.
Reading this reply made me think that this is possibly even the most important aspect.
Here you say 'Congrats - you caught the upside of variance'.
and you have a section titled 'You Have To Get Lucky' but it doesn't mention managing your luck.
Everyone has heard of BRM, but not very much is written on VLM (Variance Luck Management) perhaps because I just invented it.
How many times have you heard of people building a bankroll only to lose it all in a massive downswing period?

PRACTICE GOOD VLM
During bad VLM don't risk your bankroll on anything.
During good VLM maybe have a go at an MTT.

variance and luck are clearly not measurable but most people are aware if they are on a winning, losing, or regular streak. Recognising and managing bankroll usage with VLM could help bank roll building and avoid bankroll loss.

Oh Nooooo.... this is almost a continuation of your last time here on the forum... in the 'everything rigged thread' (yah... I remember who you are now... ugh.)

I cashed in 3 of 3 tourneys I played for one priv. forum this weekend (3rd, 5th, & ITM)... so basically I should prolly buyin to all the Sunday Majors?

 

[BigJamo]

Bankroll From Zero

Gday all, Not long back I was down to absolute zero, (Full Tilt), I then watched a video of Chris Furgusons, win $10,000 in 18 months, from nothing. I thought to myself, now thats a challenge. So here I am BROKE, with some of Chris' advice, thinking where im going to get cash from, it worked out being the Australian Regional Freeroll, (it pays $2 for 10-27 place). So now I too have now won my first $2, my next step was to work out how to get it moving, after much pondering, I decided to go for cash ring games, (only cause $1.10 Sit-n-go just didnt seem a good choice to start with), and i was on my way, 40c min. buy-in, 1-2c BB. Well its been 1 month now, and im now over the $20 mark, (im not a big Full Tilt player, maybe an hour or so daily. Gotta go now, I'll keep you all posted on how im going each month.

 

[spiderman637]

I would strongly recommend MTTs to build a bankroll from tiny amounts...Thats how spidey did it...Have a beautiful looking bankroll(never deposited a cent, except for withdrawal purposes) now in almost 7 to 8 rooms...And its all because of MTTs !!!

 

[manofthehour]

I like the bullet points. They are very interesting and thorough. I usually stick by these but soemtimes get a little off the hook as they would say like buying into higher stakes when I shouldn't be.

 

[OzExorcist]

I would strongly recommend MTTs to build a bankroll from tiny amounts...Thats how spidey did it...Have a beautiful looking bankroll(never deposited a cent, except for withdrawal purposes) now in almost 7 to 8 rooms...And its all because of MTTs !!!

While this is all well and good, I still maintain that for everyone like you that has successess with MTTs there will be hundreds more that are killed by the variance. There's just no way around that fact.

 

[Bdex]

I cant seem to build a bankroll no matter how hard i try and i dont play dumb poker i play pretty good and i just cant seem to get a break.

 

[Deathwish238]

Great thread. Currently working on my bankroll which is sitting at $60 from depositing $50 a long time ago. I'm a bit rusty and I feel like a noob lol, but I don't think I've ever played more than 1k hands online...so I have a lot to play.

I feel like a serial poster today but I have to say great post by OZ and great discussion. I really felt like I learned something. Exhibit A of why this forum is one of the best free poker resources on the net.

haha you're not a serial poster until the entire first page of a subforum has your name under Last Post next to every thread

 

[norriscjn]

Great post. Just seen this off of someone elses thread recommending this one.
I sometimes will have to agree with the mtt's. That is one huge leak of mine.

 

[rollnutilt]

Great post OZ very solid wish you had posted this before. But will be coming back to re read it until it sinks in.

 

[alaskabill]

Great post OZ very solid wish you had posted this before. But will be coming back to re read it until it sinks in.

Actually, he first posted it 6 months ago. If it was stickied or put in a FAQ or in the articles section, it wouldn't keep disappearing. (hint, hint, Dakota, or mods) I posted a link to this thread probably 6-8 times in different threads. I think I'll just start bumping it once a month. It is IMO, the best writing and discussion on bankroll management on CC. Although MrMonkey has also written some nice things on the subject.

 

[BigJamo]

Gday, Great Thread. I know my responce is way too late, but I only just found it.

Since joining CC, I have been down to Zero bankroll. Im now at $78, (I got the ball rolling with a $2 freeroll pay) and I was at $96, but had a bit of a downslide, but, ill keep grinding away and get back up there.

I started a Thread myself asking for advice on BRM, and I found that the players here where very helpfull, (wish I had found this thread earlier).

This Thread is PERFECT, for all players, especially players like myself, TY, your Info. its extremely valuable to the evolving player, like me.

Also, thanks to Mr Whatever and poker-orifice for the added input. All this info. is great, keep feeding to us.

 

[bobsay225]

I have gone the route of playing out of my bankroll and the eventual swings causing tilt,etc,etc Thank you for this very informative read

 

[kingmurda219]

dont play low games.play 1 tourney $5 bucks or more and play good.i guarantee you will increase your bank roll.

 

[OzExorcist]

dont play low games.play 1 tourney $5 bucks or more and play good.i guarantee you will increase your bank roll.

This is an interesting guarantee.

Is there any fine print, or can I assume you'll ship me $6 from your own bankroll if I don't cash in this $5 tournament?

 

[xdeucesx]

This is an interesting guarantee.

Is there any fine print, or can I assume you'll ship me $6 from your own bankroll if I don't cash in this $5 tournament?

lol advice like that guarantees he doesnt have 6$ to ship

 

[aaron_jd]

Great thread everyone. I build my bankroll with 9-person SNGs and freerolls. Sometimes I play a MTT, but that's rare.

 

[dermafx]

Lots of good information here. Thanks Oz.

 

[strikeseven]

Very useful guide that i feel many will use. 5 stars. Think this should be stickied. Another great guide might be "How to Win the Lotto: A guide on freerolls", maybe I'll make it

 

[ZNT746]

I know this is an old thread but it is a helpful one, especially in the US today when people are hesitant to deposit money on sites, a lot of people (including myself) are trying to build from freerolls. I wish I would have read this earlier because awhile ago I won $23 in a freeroll and since I've been mistakenly switching from MTT's to SNG's to cash games(all NLHE) and also PLO cash games which I never usually play, just trying to build my bankroll but failing. I'm now down to $5. After reading this I really think it is a good idea to stick to your best game. My best game is NLHE MTT's but your advice about those having too much variance is very true. My $5 bankroll just doesn't work well with those, so I'm deciding to stick to NLHE SNG's. The smallest ones are $1 so I basically have 5 tries to make the money and make a profit, I still like my odds more than if I were switching back and forth like I was. Thanks for the great thread.