Played with AA incorrectly and paid the price!

[bbiase]

My goodness...

You don't bet with aces to scare away speculative hands. You bet with aces to get VALUE from speculative hands. Aces ARE going to get cracked from time to time, and in the meantime, you should try to extract value from those hands, betting to make worse hands call.

UNIVERSAL RULE OF POKER - THERE'S THREE REASONS TO BET - ONLY THREE
1) To make worse hands call (VALUE BET)
2) To make better hands fold (bluff)
3) To deny equity of hands with potential to improve (PROTECTION)

Aces pre flop is the nuts. There's no better hands. It's the ultimate value holding pre flop. You SHOULD be betting to make worse hands call.

So pre-flop:
1) Limping is a bad option, since you're not getting the value you want from worse hands;
2) Min raising is a bad option, since you're not getting enough value from worse hands, UNLESS it's your standard raising strategy;
3) Overbetting/overraising is a bad option, since you're turning your hand faceup and telling: "hey everybody, I have aces, let me take the blinds and antes pls"

Best pre-flop strategy for aces is to follow your standard strategy pre flop raise sizings.

And YES, it's very difficult to get three streets of value with unimproved aces post flop unless you're playing a total fish willing to go to rivers with top pair or worse hands. Even those top pair type of hands are much more likely to improve by the river than aces.

I just don't see any news in the assumption: "You should always play cautiously with just one pair post flop".

 

[Anderson0001]

My goodness...

You don't bet with aces to scare away speculative hands. You bet with aces to get VALUE from speculative hands. Aces ARE going to get cracked from time to time, and in the meantime, you should try to extract value from those hands, betting to make worse hands call.

UNIVERSAL RULE OF POKER - THERE'S THREE REASONS TO BET - ONLY THREE
1) To make worse hands call (VALUE BET)
2) To make better hands fold (BLUFF)
3) To deny equity of hands with potential to improve (PROTECTION)

Aces pre flop is the nuts. There's no better hands. It's the ultimate value holding pre flop. You SHOULD be betting to make worse hands call.

So pre-flop:
1) Limping is a bad option, since you're not getting the value you want from worse hands;
2) Min raising is a bad option, since you're not getting enough value from worse hands, UNLESS it's your standard raising strategy;
3) Overbetting/overraising is a bad option, since you're turning your hand faceup and telling: "hey everybody, I have aces, let me take the blinds and antes pls"

Best pre-flop strategy for aces is to follow your standard strategy pre flop raise sizings.

And YES, it's very difficult to get three streets of value with unimproved aces post flop unless you're playing a total fish willing to go to rivers with top pair or worse hands. Even those top pair type of hands are much more likely to improve by the river than aces.

I just don't see any news in the assumption: "You should always play cautiously with just one pair post flop".

Nice! But raising to exclude speculative hands like 79 and JQ tends to give less headache since the player has chosen to go for the flop. The increase I said tends to attract hands like AK, AQ, KK, QQ, JJ and even an A8 of the same nipe. Hands that the AA might use best after the flop!

 

[strodawg]

agreed

Watch this hand and see a common mistake to play with AA.

FIRST the player gave mini raise to try to attract players to the game instead of betting. But his raise should have been between 3 and 5x to scare away speculative hands. With this he attracted a player with a marginal hand and it was bad!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRuZZR4ki4c

Yeah that's a tough hand, He should have definately raised really heavy preflop then he could have slow played after that since majority of the pot is out there. check on the flop would have helped identify two pair or better. aces is nothing with low cards everywhere so he should have been more careful.

 

[HeikoHeiko]

My practice said, that I should go all in with AA in preflop

.... i do so yesterday, preflop all in, first hand, been cracked.

Normally i didnt call sll in in first rounds, but in this tournament i want double realy fast. AA is best fir this.

But i think for the future u will only 3-5 bet. after flop all in possible.

 

[Mauno]

Doesnt look very good game for AA.
It's good to win pot against AA this way.

 

[Teranu]

I see this 2-3 times at any MTT i play, at my table only. Limping and slow-playing pocket AA or any other top pair is the worst ideea ever. In early stages when everyone has atleast 40BB i raise at least 4x + 1BB for every limper. If there is a 3-bet before me, i'll 4-bet aggresively to force everyone else out if possibly, even the one who raised before me. 50% chances that at least 1 player calls and folds at my flop bet or re-raise. 50% chances that someone will shove preflop which, resulting at least 2 players all-in, including me. Doing this i manage to keep my win rate with AA or KK over 95%. Most of times i double or even triple my pot.

 

[HeikoHeiko]

AA is (now) a raise, anytime a raise, but not an all-inn!

 

[ph_il]

The preflop raise is fine. Like someone said, we're raising AA for value, not to scare off hands.

The call on the flop and turn is standard.

Terrible shove on the river. Straight and flush get there, plus sets on the flop have you beat. You aren't beating a lot of hands here except A10 and over pairs to the board (JJ-KK) and a hand like KK will probably 4bet preflop. Just check behind on the river.

 

[cranberry]

I think that the player with AA did not play properly. With pocket cards AA need to play aggressively on the preflop and try to play with only one opponent. The more players involved in the game, the less the chances of AA cards. Perhaps, I think the player with AA wanted to do slowplay - but it didn't work out.

 

[Anderson0001]

I think that the player with AA did not play properly. With pocket cards AA need to play aggressively on the preflop and try to play with only one opponent. The more players involved in the game, the less the chances of AA cards. Perhaps, I think the player with AA wanted to do slowplay - but it didn't work out.

I agree with you. He played slow play or have fear of give raise tall and the others give fold

 

[cranberry]

I agree with you. He played slow play or have fear of give raise tall and the others give fold

Regarding the fear to raise - I realized one thing that need to play quality poker and don't be afraid to lose, if play correct.

 

[CallmeFloppy]

I think his play after the flop was what killed him. You need to re-evaluate where you are at each point in a hand.

 

[acemenow]

As for the type of raise to start, it depends on the stakes(buyin) as you will have much looser calling in lower stakes games (i think) since I don't play high stakes. Also not enough hands yet to know what kind of range these players have so a low bet basically means could call with anything till you have more information.

But I would not limp with Aces and a 2 bet is a limp here IMO, you basically want heads up with Aces and if you do not hit at least a set, There are too many hands that can beat top pair. Even if the top pair is hidden in ppA

Had I played as this guy did, I would never have pushed with them in the end too many winning combinations on that board for a top pair to be the winner IMO.

At the current blind level I would only 4-5 bet. Too early if this is an SNG or MTT to worry about trapping. Good learning experience though.


Addendum: Just read thru many of the comments basically I just reiterated what most are already saying

 

[TeUnit]

This is very dependent on the effective number of big blinds, you will maximize your winnings by playing AA differently based on stack sizes.

ie with 5bb stacks you would want to limp, but with 1000bb stacks you would want to raise big.

 

[Nr98]

This is very dependent on the effective number of big blinds, you will maximize your winnings by playing AA differently based on stack sizes.

ie with 5bb stacks you would want to limp, but with 1000bb stacks you would want to raise big.

With stacks as short as 5bb this is a 100% push, you will get paid off alot since there is alot of pressure to accumulate chips. When openraising deepstacked I'd say just raise what you normally do from that position regardless of your hand.

 

[TeUnit]

With stacks as short as 5bb this is a 100% push, you will get paid off alot since there is alot of pressure to accumulate chips. When openraising deepstacked I'd say just raise what you normally do from that position regardless of your hand.

Shoving with 5bbs loses value both from value hands that wont call and from potential bluffs.

And with a 1000 blinds raising to 2.25bbs or 2.75bbs just allows weaker hands hit 2 pair and sets etc.

 

[Tman300]

The biggest mistake I make playing pockets aces is slow playing. Never try slowplaying pockets I got beaten with 77 doing that

 

[Vin Keyzone]

Pocket Aces losing its value....tsk tsk

 

[LFC_yllnwa]

He played right, straight on the flop is very very very lucky.. On the turn should have throw.. aggression from BB should've thought..

 

[Anderson0001]

Regarding the fear to raise - I realized one thing that need to play quality poker and don't be afraid to lose, if play correct.

I totally agree with you!

I think his play after the flop was what killed him. You need to re-evaluate where you are at each point in a hand.

I feared that the second villain had a bigger sequence, so I was cautious!

I really have to evaluate that point!

 

[Booyah777]

Just go all in hopefully a donk calls lol

 

[boomboxcafe23]

While the player misplayed AA pre-flop, on a board like that you need to really slow down. Its not just 96 that has you crushed, but J9 which is a very real possibility. On the river AA really should know your beat. Sometimes you need to slow down and really look at the board. He can't beat 96, J9, two random hearts, or any kind of 2 pair in a min raise pot. At worst, its a fold on the river.

Exactly!! The villain was clueless to reading the bored and thinking of the 20+ hands that beat his AA on the flop and should have tried to play the pot as cheaply as possible.

The hero in this hand might have been a little over zealous of his straight and didnt think of the hands that could beat him. Hopefully we can all see a pattern here....

Here are a few definitions to learn from the video.

ATM or Calling Station- someone like the villain in this hand. Willing to call bets even when the odds are against them. An ATM is usually the player you want to earn your chips from

pot odds - a player's incentive to call a bet. The hero might the correct play calling the 2xbet from the villain because the pot was big enough to make the possibility of catching some luck worth the investment.

The Nuts- if the hand would have ended with the preflop the villain would of had the Nuts, the 100% sure winner. Post flop neither hero nor villain had the nuts because quite a few hands could beat both of their hands with 2 more cards to come... and with more cards to come arrives implied pot odds.

Implied Pot Odds- the 3rd player whose hand we didnt get to see might have stuck in the hand after the flop bets because had the turn card been a card to give him the Nuts, he could count on another round of bets followed by even more bets on the River.

 

[gardin555]

I raise x4 + player who sees the raise, to defend my pair of AA.
The 3 cards of the flop, is another story.., my pair of aces may lose power, the power of play its pair is in the preflop.
I do not slowplay in preflop with AA, Raise preflop by value and to defend my good pair.

 

[DrazaFFT]

From utg minraise.
From mp 2.5bb
From btn 3 bb

Better all when you have aces on a blinds

I would definitely say that it should be completely opposite that this. Actually wait, i have a question, is that the betting pattern for monster hands or your default oppening for every hand? Either way its wrong, having bets sized by the strength of your hand is easiest possible tell to pick on, if this is your default opening sizings regardles the hand then i say, open 3bb from every position but BTN where you can min raise. I open 3bb from EP MP CO and SB and open 2bb from BTN, i 3bet 8bb IP and 9bb OOP

 

[Bedobash83]

Off course, go all-in preflop