Ever get the feeling that online poker is rigged?

I am an educated guy and have been a regular visitor to Las Vegas for twenty years. I have seen a lot. However, what I see in online poker defies the imagination. Do I believe that some systems "encourage" staying in the pot by giving several people great hands - yes. Online is sooo different from in-person poker in Las Vegas.

I am going to Las Vegas this weekend and will spend mega hours at the poker tables. You can bet that I will be comparing what I see in person with what I have been seeing online.

diabloblanco said:

Blah, blah blah, rigged. Blah, blah, blah, cheated. Blah, blah, blah, too many bad beats. Blah, blah, blah, blah.

You have got to be kidding me. I didn't read this until today because I knew I would be blown away by the lack of intelligent thought contained in this thread. But as they say, curiosity (and boredom) killed the diablo.

I am amazed. These online cardrooms are freaking cash cows. They don't have to take a dime to make a killing. Why would they risk all that money for a few more cents on each rake? I have an answer for you, THEY WOULDNT.

As many serious online players out there that use tracking software and see thousnds of hands as there are and not one case of a site being officially accused or investigated for rigging hands. Its rediculous to asume because you got sucked out on X number of times out of 10 that something is fishy. Just like hackdart said, being a 60% favorite isn't a lock and you're only going to bring that hand home 60% of the time over the long run. You may lose with it 10 times in a row, slim, but a possibility.

I think this all boils down to peoples unwillingness to accept failure due to their own actions. "It has to be rigged or I would have won that hand." mentality. As for the guy questioning why sites deal a royal flush so often....you have got to be shitting me. Most poker sites deal more hands in one hour than you will see in 2 years, let alone 24 hours, so that comment was just plain thick. Take off the tin-foil hats people. Online poker is NOT rigged.

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Stand up and starts slow clap.......

So true diablo, I mentioned poker tracker a few times and the responses were absolutely sideways. There are millions of us using pokertracker and similar programs. These programs give us the ability to ensure that the game is fair on top of using it for game improvements. Before anyone else makes a "its rigged" claim please find someone who has posted actual "evidence" that sites are rigging anything. That evidence would include software statistical data.

Good Luck

I seriously doubt they can rig a poker website and like they care they receive money automatically, no matter how you do. No matter what there will be players who draw out on you, and if there werent any bad players how would you win. These websites make thousands of dollars even if you cant tell they do, not like it matters if they lose a few horrible players. Besides if they could rig the games everyone would go broke fairly quick. By the way if you could post the actual percent of hands you play on average, if you play more then 20 percent of them your going to suffer a ton of bad beats. I play approximately 10 to 15 percent of my hands and win about 55 percent of my hands if i see the flop and about 75 percent in the show down, and early on in the tournaments and other things i do brings down these percents and they are still rather decent. When you get to playing every suited card you got, connectors, and every pocket pair you will suffer a ton of so called bad beats which makes you think these are rigged. Almost every experienced player will play about 10 percent of their hands and it they should have plenty of chips. Even if your stuck not playing a hand for 20 hands who cares the blinds will hit you once or twice, and youll lose about 2 percent of your stack if that, i would rather do that then go in with marginal hands and hit something then get out drawn all the time. Doing this really makes it seem like bad beats, and makes it seem rigged. Try playing more premium hands and if you dont hit then let it go. Even learn to let go of pocket aces or kings if you have to. If you go all in with these hands with like 5 people someone will more then likely out draw you. 7 8 9 all suited comes out toss those pocket aces instead of shoving in the rest of your stack. If someone gos all in and you think there bluffing let them have it if its early who cares if they get 20 of your chips, let them have them instead of wasting everything you have on a hunch. Try playing less hands and avoid things like ace 9s ace 8s and stuff like that i see many people lose huge stacks on hands like that because they flop aces. These poker sites arent rigged the same people may win but its because they know how to bet when they hit the nuts and dont go all in with multiple people. Someone is bound to outdraw you that way.

ofcourse its rigged

I told you before I have heard it from someone who worked for a site first hand. The sites pay so much in vigs to the payment processors now they are stepping it up. Hasnt anyone noticed how bad it has gotten since the laws in the US have changed. Its like they are desperate to get as much money as they can. The only people interjecting to say it isnt rigged are affiliates, and representatives of the sites. I am sure a few others take time out to respond but why???? there is so much money being made by the sites and the affiliates why wouldnt they massage you and say its not rigged , if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it probably is. If you think its rigged your are probably right and you are. Stick to live poker when possible, the same bad beats happen but not nearly as often...Now that is an indisputable FACT.

mjavor said:

Check out what this poker player has to say. Althought I am getting no support here, I am glad I am not the only one.
Re(1): I officially resign...

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Infraction police, arrest this man!!

we definitely don't have enough poker is rigged threads around here. what we really need is someone to bump one that's 2 years old

oh, there we go

rofl nice combo

phildinn said:

I told you before I have heard it from someone who worked for a site first hand. The sites pay so much in vigs to the payment processors now they are stepping it up. Hasnt anyone noticed how bad it has gotten since the laws in the US have changed. Its like they are desperate to get as much money as they can. The only people interjecting to say it isnt rigged are affiliates, and representatives of the sites. I am sure a few others take time out to respond but why???? there is so much money being made by the sites and the affiliates why wouldnt they massage you and say its not rigged , if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it probably is. If you think its rigged your are probably right and you are. Stick to live poker when possible, the same bad beats happen but not nearly as often...Now that is an indisputable FACT.

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i beg to differ-according to pigpen02 in a recent post, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then cook it for dinner. Thanx!

phildinn said:

Stick to live poker when possible, the same bad beats happen but not nearly as often...Now that is an indisputable FACT.

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You're right, it IS an indisputable FACT. Of course, silly little me always thought it was because you see so many more hands online than in a live game...

this so many more hands thing is realy over rated Mr. affiliateIneedpeopletokeepplayingsoItoocollectrake. I see 35 hands an hour live and 60. So give it the benefit and say I see twice as many hand online as live. I dont see quads every day live. I dont see river one outers or two outers half as often as online not a fourth as often as online but maybe 1/20th of what I see online. The last time I played a ring game online I saw two straight flushes one beat the nut flush and the other beat a full house. 40 hands I played and saw two straight flushes. People say You see so many more hands. Bologne. An online session for me is 2-3 hours. A live session is 7-10 hours. I see more hands in a live session than I do online.

I love the people who say how hard it would be to manipulate just certain peoples cards or they say I am an IT guy and they cant do that. BOLOGNE. Give the programers some credit they can do exactly what they want specificaly how they want it. Online poker is not poker it is a vehicle for for businesses to make money. The game being played live is different.

So please may the next affiliate or part of the system please step up and refute what I am saying.

First of all, I'm not an "affiliate" or "part of the system." I'm a normal poker player who occasionally enters an online tournament. There's no way to for me or anyone else to "refute" what you're saying to your satisfaction because your mind is already made up and any evidence to the contrary of your claims is dismissed by you as being provided by "the system."

There's no reason to argue with someone who won't listen. The best thing is for us to quit trying to convince you that online poker isn't rigged and for you to stop trying to convince us it is.

phildinn said:

this so many more hands thing is realy over rated Mr. affiliateIneedpeopletokeepplayingsoItoocollectrake. I see 35 hands an hour live and 60. So give it the benefit and say I see twice as many hand online as live. I dont see quads every day live. I dont see river one outers or two outers half as often as online not a fourth as often as online but maybe 1/20th of what I see online. The last time I played a ring game online I saw two straight flushes one beat the nut flush and the other beat a full house. 40 hands I played and saw two straight flushes. People say You see so many more hands. Bologne. An online session for me is 2-3 hours. A live session is 7-10 hours. I see more hands in a live session than I do online.

I love the people who say how hard it would be to manipulate just certain peoples cards or they say I am an IT guy and they cant do that. BOLOGNE. Give the programers some credit they can do exactly what they want specificaly how they want it. Online poker is not poker it is a vehicle for for businesses to make money. The game being played live is different.

So please may the next affiliate or part of the system please step up and refute what I am saying.

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Why do you play online and what are you doing in an online poker forum?????

Honestly - if I believed what you believe I would be done with it all and embarrassed to admit that I play.

phildinn said:

BOLOGNE.

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You usually see "Baloney" in this context.

(seinfeld)

You went with Balogne?

(/seinfeld)

If I'm not mistaken, it's spelled "Bologna"

"I dont see river one outers or two outers half as often"

That's correct. You only see river one outers 5% of the time whether you're online or not.

And lol if you think that you see more hands live than online, unless you're using an automatic dealer/shuffler.

dakota-xx said:

Why do you play online and what are you doing in an online poker forum?????

Honestly - if I believed what you believe I would be done with it all and embarrassed to admit that I play.

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This isnt just an online poker forum.
Hey anyone out there play live poker, you know the real game?

surely you could come up with something wittier.

Emperor IX said:

If I'm not mistaken, it's spelled "Bologna"

"I dont see river one outers or two outers half as often"

That's correct. You only see river one outers 5% of the time whether you're online or not.

And lol if you think that you see more hands live than online, unless you're using an automatic dealer/shuffler.

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please learn to read before you reply , you obviously didnt read what you have replied to.

phildinn said:

This isnt just an online poker forum.
Hey anyone out there play live poker, you know the real game?

surely you could come up with something wittier.

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I noticed you skipped the first part of the question lol. And yea - with your 20 or 30+ posts you definitely have spent more time in here than I have and would know a lot more about what this forum is about. My bad....

Let me do a brief search of our live poker discussions... okay done. Funny I didn't see you in any of them lol.

Emperor IX said:

If I'm not mistaken, it's spelled "Bologna"

"I dont see river one outers or two outers half as often"

That's correct. You only see river one outers 5% of the time whether you're online or not.

And lol if you think that you see more hands live than online, unless you're using an automatic dealer/shuffler.

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If you are seeing river one outers 5% of the time your proving my point. Please call someone who knows what odds are then write back that you have found the answer.

You know casinos have these things called automatic shufflers. Yeah you see the dealer puts the deck in a box and it shuffles for him. Then he uses another deck to deal. Then when the hand is done he pulls one deck out and puts the other in. Its realy neat too cause these people are profesionals and can do it quite quickly. Dont respond if you have no reference point to work with. In a 7-10 Hour session of live poker I see many more hands than 2-3 hour session of online. I see twice as many hands and many fewer action flops, full houses, flushes, stratights, quads, outkicked top pair, etc.

If your playing online you have no reference.

rofl @ bologne

oh, and as for bumping a 2 year old thread to troll, please stop.

phildinn said:

If you are seeing river one outers 5% of the time your proving my point. Please call someone who knows what odds are then write back that you have found the answer.

You know casinos have these things called automatic shufflers. Yeah you see the dealer puts the deck in a box and it shuffles for him. Then he uses another deck to deal. Then when the hand is done he pulls one deck out and puts the other in. Its realy neat too cause these people are profesionals and can do it quite quickly. Dont respond if you have no reference point to work with. In a 7-10 Hour session of live poker I see many more hands than 2-3 hour session of online. I see twice as many hands and many fewer action flops, full houses, flushes, stratights, quads, outkicked top pair, etc.

If your playing online you have no reference.

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You got the part right about the automatic shufflers in the casinos, but you saying you see twice as many hands as online is complete crap (yes, I do play live, and usually for much longer than 2 or 3 hours when I do). And trust me, the same kind of action hands happen live. I've been involved in a few myself.

Anyway (yawn)...

yeah.before online poker people would blame the dealer for their badluck now they are blaming the softwares...?

It definitely seems that way, but I'm not yet convinced. For I've seen crazier things happen on a real deck. Just last weekend in live play, I got suited hole cards & flopped a flush 3 hands in a row! Flopped!
Amusingly, one opponent said "that chit doesn't even happen on-line". lol

Hawkeye said:

Can someone explain to me exactly how you could rig a room or a site? I personally think it is close to impossible and to understand how a server system works, what inputs would have to be made for each room etc... it is a huge undertaking. Plus, why have you never heard a employee blow the whistle, or an oversite agency do an investigation? Plus the fact that i make the bet, raise and call. I don't have to...it is a independant choice for me to bet 2-5 off, or A-A.

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It is not a big problem to set up random number generators to favor certain numbers that have limits (like cards 2 thru A, 52) and have the deal favor all chipstacks over say 5000 chips. Not to the exclusion of the others just the curve would be move over and higher count cards go to the heavier chip stacks. What would the house gain? Faster thru-pass of money. Do they do that? I don't think so because some talented math kid could record the hand and produce the results curves and expose them.

I would like to see the poker places online use one random shuffle and freeze the cards for the complete round. Just like real cards, instead of leaving the remaining number float which is what I think they do. If anyone knows differently I'd like to know that.

Of course it isn't rigged. I pride myself on being one of Englands worst poker players and I still carry on playing. If it was rigged, the sites would occassionally shove a few wins in my direction. Come to think of it, they may have done but I was too crap to play the hands and probably folded them instead.

Besides, as far as I know, a "rig" is a horse that hasn't been castrated properly. It can still fire the odd blank every now and again but doesn't stand a chance of going on to the finish.

Sound familiar?

Snowman

XXX

/thread plz