SUNGLASSES IN POKER: Maybe douchey, but cheating?

Zorba · May 13, 2010

OzExorcist said:
Hard to say - if the marks they were making really were invisible to anyone who wasn't wearing the glasses and the people doing it were halfway competent then I expect it wouldn't be that hard to get it past the dealer. We've only got one set of eyes, after all, and most of the time we'll be looking where the current action is.

Plus I'd assumed that if anyone was doing this during a live game they'd be more likely to do something like touch their finger on an ink source in their pocket then smudge it onto the card with their fingertip rather than using a pen, so the action could look 100% innocent.

Or maybe they could have it on the underside of their card protector? I dunno, 99.9% of the card marking problems we get in the games I deal (and the problems are rare to start with) are with unintentional bending because for the most part I deal to n00bs

I agree with you on ppl possibly dabbing something on a few cards but they wouldn't be able to mark the whole deck and then be able to tell exactly what each cards is.

Bending of cards or somehow creasing a few cards is what I have come accross, I think ppl that are caught doing this should be taken out back of the venue and persuaded in a special way not to come back.

Mortis · May 13, 2010

Nothing will ever beat what Phil Laak did at the table at the wsop ME in... 2008, I think it was. Not douchey... but I just thought it was appropriate here.. lol.

jaymfc · May 13, 2010

happy to see OP was on right side after reading title

lookin good stick

TheNoob said:
I don't understand how it could even be a question that wearing sunglasses is cheating. Of course it's not.

-Phil Ivey27 said:
His argument is totally irrational, and although I respect him greatly, it's really not even worth reading.

Wearing sunglasses being cheating is one of the dumbest things i've heard in my life

Crummy said:
I normally agree with a lot of what Daniel says, however this is the most insane thing he has ever brought up. It makes no sense!

very true all

I don't worry about my eyes being a tell but probably have many others . lol at what stakes are ok and low stakes are not , $50 to some can be more valuable than a rich f*** feels about a $1000 . but I understand the point

LombardiStix said:
I am completely against sunglasses in live poker venues. I think they should be against the rules along with anything else that hides your face while you play. I think it is bad for the game. As poker has become more "mainstream" it will change. Just as all games/sports do as they grow. Rules are made along the way to keep them competitive and sporting. IMO live poker is differentiated from OL poker in a few ways, but one of the main ways is the ability to read your opponent face to face. If we take out this facet of live poker we might as well just play online from home. I want them to be different because they ARE different. I see I'm in the minority, but even if you disagree I hope you can at least see the merit in a sunglasses free game.

Stix

yea and they should be forced to answer questions too , I like to hear their voice and it's cheating to hide it

sorry I see no merit except possible cheating

Zorba said:
indoors they make you look like someone that wants to look like the pro's but without the skill.

don't be such a hater . I resent that remark as a look-alike pro with no skill . and for the record thats the only time I ever wear them

Sean Pilgrim · May 13, 2010

In b4 Bazerk!

Toor · May 13, 2010

white_lytning said:
Did someone really just say card rooms are bright? Where do you play?

I think sunglasses are funny. Especially because most of the people that I find wearing them are rather fishy. When the kids sit down and puts his sunglasses on and then ear phones in I think it sends the message that you are a defensive player and are scared. It almost screams low confidence.

With that said, I dont think its cheating.

I've played live just once but the psychological effect of my sunglasses and my black hat seemed to intimidate players. The dealer set the tone nicknaming me Chris Ferguson

I made it to the last few at the final table without ever getting a hand purely based on image.

Sean Pilgrim · May 13, 2010

Must have been a small tourney.

bazerk · May 13, 2010

Although I'm an avid Oakley fan, I prefer to wear them only outside. @ the poker table I pass on wearing sunglasses as I tend to have to squint as it is to see the board. As indicated by OzExorcist, Daniel does have a valid point that sunglasses could possibly be used as a cheating-type device...if anyone ever happens to go to Barona Valley Ranch in San Diego, they have a historical display of the various devices peeps have used to cheat @ cards (not just specific to poker but other card games as well & some are so freaking obvious one experiences a 'you gotta be kidding me' moment). As far as tells, I look more towards body language than for facial clues. For me, having sunglasses would probably be a tell...I would be inconsistent about putting them on or taking them off...LOL.

Sean Pilgrim · May 13, 2010

Sean Pilgrim said:
In b4 Bazerk!

I win lol

bazerk · May 13, 2010

Sean Pilgrim said:
I win lol

Ha, I'm gonna go hang out in my 'User CP' area & await thread updates...try & stalk me there...LOL...may even wear sunglasses.

Toor · May 13, 2010

Sean Pilgrim said:
Must have been a small tourney.

Not that big, no. Unfortunately we don't see many big tournaments here. Still, I'm a situational player. Being card dead brings out the best in me. Anyway, my point is that the disguise made it harder for players to form an image of me. I appeared to play very tight, folded or raised, didn't participate in table chatter and almost never had to show a hand. Still, there were some dead giveaways that I was new to live play: Trembling hands and unintentionally bending the cards when looking at them. I just think the appearance confused them and masquaraded my live poker noobishness to a great extent.

RichKo · May 13, 2010

I think Sunglasses indoors period is kinda douchey. One exception...If I'm ever wearing sunglasses at a poker table, chances are I just got baked out back and my eyes look like they are bleeding.

5766jerome · May 13, 2010

How is there anything wrong with wearing sunglasses in poker? I wear them a lot while I play and when other people wear them, I don't think that their cheating.

OzExorcist · May 14, 2010

5766jerome said:
How is there anything wrong with wearing sunglasses in poker? I wear them a lot while I play and when other people wear them, I don't think that their cheating.

Check out the video a 20 or so posts back, Negreanu was referring specifically to the potential for people to mark cards with inks that can only be seen through tinted glasses.

Sean Pilgrim · May 14, 2010

I saw the video last night... astonishing. They would definitely have to be filtered with a special lens correct?

et1961 · May 14, 2010

sunglasses ok

In my opinion wearing sunglasses is not cheating. Many tells can be seen through a players eyes, and disguising those tells is just a part of poker. Every player does whatever they can to hide their tells.

Sunglasses personally don't bother me at the table as I have learned to loook for other tells. Sometimes this works and sometimes it doesn't. I have a BA in social services and sociology and have done a considerable amount of studies in kinetics-the study of body language and movement. The body can give many other tells other than through the eyes. The better poker players(myself excluded) learn how to mask many of these tells.

Neoblast · May 14, 2010

Hum I think the player using sunglasses get some advantage but since it is permitted everyone can use them so... I don't see that as cheating.
I never used them yet though..

cheddachris · May 14, 2010

Wearing shades is nowhere close to being considered cheating in my book, it has almost become part of the game these "poker shades" strange hats and goodluck charms players bring to the table, people have been rockin' the poker shades for quite sometime now

NCfoldem · May 14, 2010

Wearing sunglasses is perfectly legal, but should be banned. Reading your opponent is one of the most (THE most?) important aspects of the game - everyone should wear sunglasses or no one should. Everyone would look ridiculous, so I vote for no one wearing them.

Sean Pilgrim · May 14, 2010

I think people should read the OP and follow up discussion before posting in a thread. You all are missing what we are ACTUALLY talking about. It's not the shades it's the potential to cheat by marking cards with an invisible ink that you can only see through special lenses.

bolda3 · May 14, 2010

I was really torn between the last 2 choices -lol-but I really am not affected by sunglasses in live poker. I do think its a bit "tooly" for the "i'm so good you can't read me and my cool sunglass" kinda people, but sunglasses can't cover nervousness or discomfort.

arty:

jh1spartanfan · May 14, 2010

NCfoldem said:
Wearing sunglasses is perfectly legal, but should be banned. Reading your opponent is one of the most (THE most?) important aspects of the game - everyone should wear sunglasses or no one should. Everyone would look ridiculous, so I vote for no one wearing them.

Everyone CAN wear them, but some people just choose not to. Yes, you get an advantage by wearing them, but it's not an unfair advantage because everyone can use them.

Wolfpack43ACC · May 15, 2010

white_lytning said:
Did someone really just say card rooms are bright? Where do you play?

I think sunglasses are funny. Especially because most of the people that I find wearing them are rather fishy. When the kids sit down and puts his sunglasses on and then ear phones in I think it sends the message that you are a defensive player and are scared. It almost screams low confidence.

With that said, I dont think its cheating.

You're the exact reason why I do wear sunglasses at the table sometimes. It's fun when someone assumes you are some fishy douche just because you are wearing sunglasses. Even more fun when I'm stacking your chips too.

Stick66 · May 15, 2010

Wolfpack43ACC said:
You're the exact reason why I do wear sunglasses at the table sometimes. It's fun when someone assumes you are some fishy douche just because you are wearing sunglasses. Even more fun when I'm stacking your chips too.

+1

I even like to accent my sunglasses with a funky fedora and sometimes even a touristy loud Hawaiian shirt.

:icon_geek :icon_geek

Zorba · May 15, 2010

jaymfc said:
don't be such a hater . I resent that remark as a look-alike pro with no skill . and for the record thats the only time I ever wear them

I'm trying to not be a hater, but when I see kids fidgeting whith their sunglasses instead of playing when it is their turn, it is hard not to be a hater.

Sean Pilgrim said:
In b4 Bazerk!

lol

rounder22 · May 15, 2010

This is a non issue to me its all about preference here.

SUNGLASSES IN POKER: Maybe douchey, but cheating?

What do you think of sunglasses in live poker?

I hate sunglasses in poker... because it IS like cheating.

I hate sunglasses in poker... but it's not cheating, just douchey.

I like sunglasses in poker and wearing them ISN'T cheating.

I could care less either way since there's more to poker than this.

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