Why do I have no disiplin with br management..

calibreeze · Oct 25, 2007

So I won $170 tonight and then busted out cause i played $33 heads up games now back to br $0.! I played for like 9 hours today too.. i need to set limits

Stick66 · Oct 25, 2007

calibreeze said:
So I won $170 tonight and then busted out cause i played $33 heads up games now back to br $0.! I played for like 9 hours today too.. i need to set limits

Was $170 your total BR?

At $170, I think $5 SNG's is the highest I'd go. Cash game stakes would be about 5c/10c NL. When your BR gets to $250, go for $10 SNG's & 10c/25c NL cash.

nightmoves44 · Oct 25, 2007

limits

I got to ask you,Why in the world would you do that?Someone goad you into it?or goad yourself into it?ask yourself why it happened then stop and think on it.You really should beat yrself up over it too,this way you will remember not to do that again.This is real money!
The next time you win some money,even 5-10 bux,stop and think how to work it.bUT BEFORE THAT EVEN,HOW MUCH WOULD YOU BANK BEFORE YOU WOULD CASH OUT? SET A GOAL TO REACH.I would have taken that money and played micro limit hands until I reached the points I need to withdraw.
When you play rake hands,set a time limit and a loss limit.Its better to quit or switch sites than to go tilted into a game.Also you played way too many hours,If you would disciplne yourself you could go far,people dont plan to fail,they *fail to plan* as the saying goes,and its true.
Unless you tighten up,youll keep doing the wrong thing.There are books to help you set priorities and goals.Read up all you can,online and books if you need to.
I won about 5 bux at pokerstars recently in a freeroll,I took that and played micro-limit ring games and now I got about 15 bux.If I lose $2 its time to quit or go to another site.If N When I win $150 bux,Ill cash 100 out.I sure could use an xtra 100 bux per month.Set your own personal goals,as I have as an example.Good luck n dont be a fish,go fishing!

calibreeze · Oct 25, 2007

ya 170 was my total br -_-

riffpoker · Oct 25, 2007

i wanted to reply to a thread

ratmantoo · Oct 25, 2007

bankroll management is one of the hardest disciplines to master IMO and my greatest downfall too.

Set limits and stick to them. It really sucks when you've done this but are having a good run and decide "oh just another 10 mins" and then loose half of your winnings

ph_il · Oct 25, 2007

MrSticker said:
Was $170 your total BR?

At $170, I think $5 SNG's is the highest I'd go. Cash game stakes would be about 5c/10c NL. When your BR gets to $250, go for $10 SNG's & 10c/25c NL cash.

I agree with playing $10 + $1 SNGs should be ok with a BR of $250, though I think a slighter bigger one would be better. At least $300, but I disagree with the playing .10/.25 cash games. Max buy in is $25 and a BR of $ 250 will only allow him 10 buy ins, which I dont think is enough for cash games at this limit and to be able to build a BR comfortably.

Ronaldadio · Oct 25, 2007

calibreeze said:
So I won $170 tonight and then busted out cause i played $33 heads up games now back to br $0.! I played for like 9 hours today too.. i need to set limits

You have the answer, just make sure you set realistic limits.

IMO, if over a year u can increase your bankroll by 10% a month u r doing well. So, $170 @ 10% a month x 12 months = a bankroll of $600 at the end of the year !!!

zachvac · Oct 25, 2007

Ronaldadio said:
You have the answer, just make sure you set realistic limits.

IMO, if over a year u can increase your bankroll by 10% a month u r doing well. So, $170 @ 10% a month x 12 months = a bankroll of $600 at the end of the year !!!

That's funny math, 170*(1.1^12) [or 170+170*0.1+170*0.1*0.1+...] = $533.53

And I'd hardly say you can increase your BR by 10% no matter what, or the millionaires would be playing poker instead of investing in the stock market. You don't honestly think someone starting with a million bucks at the beginning of the year would end out the year with $3.1 million+ do you?

Ronaldadio · Oct 25, 2007

zachvac said:
That's funny math, 170*(1.1^12) [or 170+170*0.1+170*0.1*0.1+...] = $533.53

And I'd hardly say you can increase your BR by 10% no matter what, or the millionaires would be playing poker instead of investing in the stock market. You don't honestly think someone starting with a million bucks at the beginning of the year would end out the year with $3.1 million+ do you?

First, I`m English. The true abreviation of mathematics is maths, not math (sorry, but this is an Americanism I hate!!!)

Second, I know it was not exact. I have more to do with my time to be that exact.

Third, I said "If you are increasing your bankroll by 10% a month you are doing well" Key word being If.

Forth, if you play freerolls any return you gain will be pure profit, therefore not affecting your capital.

Finally, it does not follow that if u increase your bankroll by 10% playing $0.10/ 0.20 u will increase by 10% playing $100/200. IMO, and it is only an opinion, the variabless are less playing lower limits - you can make money playing `ABC` poker. That would not be the case when the stakes raise.

Hope that clears up any confusion

KingCurtis · Oct 25, 2007

wow i think a big threat to your bankroll is playing so much...when you won that 170$ take a break bask in your winnings then come back the next day playing reasonable limits like talked about above with a fresh new start....when you play so long you get tired and make bad decisions!!

zachvac · Oct 25, 2007

Ronaldadio said:
First, I`m English. The true abreviation of mathematics is maths, not math (sorry, but this is an Americanism I hate!!!)

And I'm American, over here the abbreviation (did I correct your spelling of abbreviation?) is math. This is an international forum and math is correct where I live. You understood what I meant, I fail to see the big deal.

Ronaldadio said:
Second, I know it was not exact. I have more to do with my time to be that exact.

If you're going to estimate, say it's an estimate. If I'm going to do a calculation, I like to do it right. if you own a calculator (hell even google's a calculator now) the calculation takes about 15 seconds.

Ronaldadio said:
Third, I said "If you are increasing your bankroll by 10% a month you are doing well" Key word being If.

I'm sorry, the way I read it you made it seem like 10% per month could be expected if you were playing well.

Ronaldadio said:
Forth, if you play freerolls any return you gain will be pure profit, therefore not affecting your capital.

I don't know of anyone who can win consistently (even on the magnitude of cents per day) at freerolls.

Ronaldadio said:
Finally, it does not follow that if u increase your bankroll by 10% playing $0.10/ 0.20 u will increase by 10% playing $100/200. IMO, and it is only an opinion, the variabless are less playing lower limits - you can make money playing `ABC` poker. That would not be the case when the stakes raise.

Hope that clears up any confusion

Totally agree, I was stating this exactly, that you cannot expect to increase your BR by 10% if you have a lot of money. I just think the concept of percentage of BR won per month is flawed. If you put more money in your BR you can't expect a better return. You should probably express profit in an hourly rate or BB/100 hands at a certain limit (and since hands/hour can be predicted one can be derived from the other). The variables I'd take into account would be time spent playing, limits playing, and obviously how good they are. You took into account how good they are and the size of their BR. Barring busting out because you're playing limits that are too high, BR shouldn't impact profits. Just the point I was trying to make.

Seneku · Oct 25, 2007

zachvac said:
That's funny math, 170*(1.1^12) [or 170+170*0.1+170*0.1*0.1+...] = $533.53

And I'd hardly say you can increase your BR by 10% no matter what, or the millionaires would be playing poker instead of investing in the stock market. You don't honestly think someone starting with a million bucks at the beginning of the year would end out the year with $3.1 million+ do you?

Please don't correct people if you're wrong yourself. 170*(1.1^12) = 170*1.1*1.1*1.1 etc., not the way you showed it.

Ronaldadio · Oct 25, 2007

Zach, let not fall out???

When I check out this forum I do it as a bit of fun and to have a chat. I own my own business ($10,000,000 pa turn over consultancy) so I am under a lot of pressure and therefore just use this as a chat forum - nothing exact. Its good to hear the views of ppl who enjoy the same game I play.

The basis to what I was saying, to clarify.

If u r talking bankroll management u r taking the game a lot more serious than a lot of others.

So, increasing your bankroll from $170 to $600 in 12 months, although it will be hard, is achievable. I know this because I have done it!!!

I did it on the back of a few wins/ high cash placings in MTT & good bankroll management.

I then moved to higher stakes.

I do accept the profit per hour, but it does not work as well for MTT and SNG`s - its fine for ring games.

zachvac · Oct 25, 2007

Seneku said:
Please don't correct people if you're wrong yourself. 170*(1.1^12) = 170*1.1*1.1*1.1 etc., not the way you showed it.

Sorry, typed it wrong. Note that 170*1.1 = 170+170*.1

170+170*.1+(170+170*.1)*.1 is how I should have phrased it. But when you calculate it you do it in steps. I start with 170 and add .1*170 (actually I multiply by 1.1, but this is more clear). Then you take that number and add .1*that number. For the purpose of writing it out that means adding the entire part*.1, so the third month would be 170+170*.1+(170+170*.1)*.1 + (170+170*.1+(170+170*.1)*.1)*.1.

I wasn't correcting, I was trying to explain it to people who may have not seen the way the math worked simply using 170*(1.1^12). I was wrong the first time but I think that clarifies it.

Seneku · Oct 25, 2007

I see a lot of topics about BR management and I agree that BR management is very important. But there another thing that's also very important imo when you want to build a big BR from a small starting BR fast. That's bonus whoring. I make $400 extra a month just by clearing bonusses while playing 25NL. There are a couple of bonusses on this site and on some other sites, I suggest you check them out.

zachvac · Oct 25, 2007

Ronaldadio said:
When I check out this forum I do it as a bit of fun and to have a chat. I own my own business ($10,000,000 pa turn over consultancy) so I am under a lot of pressure and therefore just use this as a chat forum - nothing exact. Its good to hear the views of ppl who enjoy the same game I play.

The basis to what I was saying, to clarify.

If u r talking bankroll management u r taking the game a lot more serious than a lot of others.

So, increasing your bankroll from $170 to $600 in 12 months, although it will be hard, is achievable. I know this because I have done it!!!

I did it on the back of a few wins/ high cash placings in MTT & good bankroll management.

I then moved to higher stakes.

I do accept the profit per hour, but it does not work as well for MTT and SNG`s - its fine for ring games.

I'm sorry, but when you started off your last post telling me that since I did it the American way I did it wrong. You probably wouldn't like it if I told you "it's not maths, that's the idiot Brittish way of writing it, math is the way it is". I do agree with most of what you said here though.

nightmoves44 · Oct 25, 2007

br

As for the 5c-10c tables,I was using this as an example to build up money at Ring games after winning 5 dollars in a freeroll.It is an example of My strategy with 5 dollars,not a plan for everyone to follow,its my plan to build up a little more cash to move on up, and It Is workin for myself,as I have around 15 dollars instead of 5 now.
I was giving an example of self discipline,not an example for everyone to use to get rich.Everyone needs to find their own way,whethr its sng,ring games.or just freerolls.
So,the moral of the story still is,Set goals,Stick strictly to them,Make your own plan based on your own preferences(my plan is working for me),everyones plan will not be the same.and remember to have some fun too.Enuff said,I hope I made my point.

tenbob · Oct 25, 2007

If you take your full bankroll to a table your a gambler not a poker player.

End of.

BR managment is an inherant part of the game. Learn it.

aliengenius · Oct 26, 2007

Why is the question. He clearly knows he doesn't have br mgmt skills.

So, possible reasons:
1. you have a gambling problem
2. you don't appreciate poker for poker's sake and just want to gambool
3. you are so wealthy that $170 is meaningless money to you
4. (other)

Solutions:
1. Take gambling anonymous' test and see if you have a "problem".
2. WANT to win at the game of poker from a competitive standpoint more than you want to "win money" in general.
3. see above.
4. (other)

naruto_miu · Oct 26, 2007

Lol, Aliengenius, That's just ruthless, the way u broke it down. As for calibreez, I really don't even know what to tell u, besides u seem to be making the same mistakes, i've done more then once in the past right now. The best advice i can give u, is just live and learn really, i mean, It happend, ain't really nothing u can do, just forget about it, and move on. Like everyone said, set a limit, take a break when ur up, do something other then stay on the comp..
But so u know, most ppl have made the same mistake, I know i have, and more then once and trust me it was alot more then $170, I too though made the money from a freeroll, and just kept flipping it and flipping it, untill i too went broke... All i can say is u live and learn from ur mistakes, it took me acouple've mishaps, but i've learned, lol.
Hope that helps at all

calibreeze · Oct 26, 2007

Well I dont have a problem I dont have the urge to gamble I can play with play money on freerolls I just think its fun to see the money. $170 is and isnt alot to me. Im still in hs so Really nothing for me to buy but pizza and root beer. But yea the only reason I play so much is because I think its fun after i lost my money i was registered for a free roll o_o. Thanks for the tips I just need to play at lower stakes, and not try for a get rich quick scheme

ChuckTs · Oct 26, 2007

calibreeze said:
Im still in hs so Really nothing for me to buy but pizza and root beer.

There was a lot more to buy than that when I was in school...

Anyways, if you want to make money in poker, start practicing proper bankroll management. Lots (myself included) have trouble disciplining themselves when they first start out, but if you find yourself constantly doing this, then maybe poker isn't for you.

If it's just for fun, and you don't mind cashing in freerolls and blowing your winnings, then by all means keep doing it. More money for the food chain

Ronaldadio · Oct 26, 2007

aliengenius said:
2. you don't appreciate poker for poker's sake and just want to gambool

Solutions:
2. WANT to win at the game of poker from a competitive standpoint more than you want to "win money" in general.

I like this point. Nothing worse than sitting in a freeroll and playing like a nutta !!

I definatly play the game from a competative standpoint. If I`m in a freeroll or $50 buy in MTT I will play to win, I won`t change my game plan, other than to combat my opponents.

MooseLee420 · Oct 26, 2007

Chris Ferguson did an experiment on BR mangaement at FT. He apparantly started with 0, won a free-roll etc. and then used specific rules to BR management. After a year or more, he had ammassed 10,000. I am not good at following rules. I have my own patterns, including losing around 10% of my winnings immediately. These are indicators and I am changing my patterns, I still so not have a high BR, but increasing my stakes as my bankroll increases and making surew to bail when the higher limits are eating me for breakfast, Sincerly, MooseLee, ( or Mueslix, depending on the day)

Why do I have no disiplin with br management..

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