Personally I started with freerolls, however I think it is ok to put some real money. The game is different when you play with your own cash 😉
I started with cash games and had no clue that there are tournaments for "normal" players, nowadays I think that was pretty good. Most of the people I know (myself too) or those I played with play totally different in tournaments than in normal games and again there is a difference between freerolls and MTTs. I'd recommend to start with normal cash games with as much players on the table as possible and by the time you know the basics and got some good feeling for it you can try out other kinds of poker...
All depends on how much time you have at your disposal, and how good you are at poker. Freerolls take a lot of time, but if you are unsure of you're skill, and have the time, win some freeroll money first so your not wasting a deposit/deposit reward.
Lose, Lose, Lose, Reflect, Glory!
Finally a person in this thread who actually makes sense. I'm not even going to bother to read the rest of it because I don't want to see page after page of people trying to tell a new player to "learn the game" and "build a bankroll" using freerolls.
This is absolutely terrible advice and to Roman's point, can be counterproductive.
If you're talking about ACR, the freerolls are an absolute joke and need to be SERiOUSLY revamped. The very best you can do is spend 4.5 hours (with 5 min breaks at 0:55) playing with 600-1000+ people, taking it all down and collecting your whopping $2.50. If your intention was to do that to go play cash, GOOD LUCK. Even at the 1/2c tables your 2.50 will be at risk within the first orbit.
NOW, if you're talking about any of the "extras" on there that pay, on average, $25 then OKAY, there is a slightly greater incentive to try and TID. But even then you're probably looking at $5 or so up top. If you're new and you're any good, you're going to be fortunate to see about $0.14 added to your account. Now you have the totally sweet option of waiting until you have enough to play OD MTT SnG (0.55) or cash (0.80) or just throw it all away on the spin to win slots! Luckily, in these tourneys there *might* be slightly less people simply because of the password requirement. But really, finding it is about as hard as any other Internet search like IMDB to remind you the name of the movie where John Travolta and Nicholas Cage switch faces.
The only caveat is the Jackpot Freerolls and other events like this. If you're at $0 and you TID it is a pretty nice outcome for your newfound bankroll because the pool starts at $250. But again, like most every tournament online today, the structure is TERRIBLE for the top players, as too many entrants "cash" and when they do it is literally for pennies. But enough of those pennies add up to take away from how much top finishers deserved to have earned.
For me, my first experience with MTTs would have NEVER been as lucrative as it was if today's idiotic structures were used. Luckily it was not, so my $10+1 entry grossed me over $11k since over 8000 people played in it.
TODAY, freerolls should only be used for those that have nothing in their account and no real means of getting anything into their account. As an alternative, you could play "for free" on the "wsop Social Game (through facebook or App)" and win MILLIONS or BILLIONS (of fake money chips). Or, better yet, you could go play at Poker Mafia where they GIVE YOU 300 BILLION chips every day and wind up quickly with QUADRILLIONS in your account. That being said, Poker Mafia is the furthest thing from real poker. Even the highest buyin tables are nothing but AIPF Bingo fests. Fun for what they are (entertainment of sorts) but not poker. WSOP is a little better, but still, you can be like me and LOSE over 16 Billion in a head's up hand to a runner runner and a guy explaining "it's just fake chips anyway."
Did you find a clear, tangible and cohesive point in there anywhere? If so, let me know. Point is, f* freerolls unless you have no other option. Even if this is just a hobby for you, how many hobbies do you know of that you can do for free? (A few, I'm sure, but not many and not if you're "serious" about it) So man up and deposit at least SOMETHING.
Only THEN do the real decisions come into play. Do I risk it all for this big GTD? Or do I play in small increments to "manage my bankroll"? Do I call this all in for all my chips with AK on a King high uncoordinated board? Or do I think there are better spots for me to more calmly and slowly accumulate chips?
Word of advice: WHEN you deposit and play for real, do so at smaller stakes. It doesn't HAVE to be smallest stakes possible. But it should be small. Fact is, unless you are "The One" and a complete anomaly, YOU ARE GOING TO LOSE. The sooner you come to grips with that, the better off you'll be. INVEST in your early years of LOSSES. They pay dividends in BIG WINS in the future if you approach the game correctly.
Watch KID POKER on Netflix if you haven't already and I challenge you to tell me that Daniel DOES become #1 money list if he hadn't gone broke soooo many times on initial trips to Vegas.
Roman Tsygankov said:
Finally a person in this thread who actually makes sense. I'm not even going to bother to read the rest of it because I don't want to see page after page of people trying to tell a new player to "learn the game" and "build a bankroll" using freerolls.
This is absolutely terrible advice and to Roman's point, can be counterproductive.
If you're talking about ACR, the freerolls are an absolute joke and need to be SERiOUSLY revamped. The very best you can do is spend 4.5 hours (with 5 min breaks at 0:55) playing with 600-1000+ people, taking it all down and collecting your whopping $2.50. If your intention was to do that to go play cash, GOOD LUCK. Even at the 1/2c tables your 2.50 will be at risk within the first orbit.
NOW, if you're talking about any of the "extras" on there that pay, on average, $25 then OKAY, there is a slightly greater incentive to try and TID. But even then you're probably looking at $5 or so up top. If you're new and you're any good, you're going to be fortunate to see about $0.14 added to your account. Now you have the totally sweet option of waiting until you have enough to play OD MTT SnG (0.55) or cash (0.80) or just throw it all away on the spin to win slots! Luckily, in these tourneys there *might* be slightly less people simply because of the password requirement. But really, finding it is about as hard as any other Internet search like IMDB to remind you the name of the movie where John Travolta and Nicholas Cage switch faces.
The only caveat is the Jackpot Freerolls and other events like this. If you're at $0 and you TID it is a pretty nice outcome for your newfound bankroll because the pool starts at $250. But again, like most every tournament online today, the structure is TERRIBLE for the top players, as too many entrants "cash" and when they do it is literally for pennies. But enough of those pennies add up to take away from how much top finishers deserved to have earned.
For me, my first experience with MTTs would have NEVER been as lucrative as it was if today's idiotic structures were used. Luckily it was not, so my $10+1 entry grossed me over $11k since over 8000 people played in it.
TODAY, freerolls should only be used for those that have nothing in their account and no real means of getting anything into their account. As an alternative, you could play "for free" on the "wsop Social Game (through facebook or App)" and win MILLIONS or BILLIONS (of fake money chips). Or, better yet, you could go play at Poker Mafia where they GIVE YOU 300 BILLION chips every day and wind up quickly with QUADRILLIONS in your account. That being said, Poker Mafia is the furthest thing from real poker. Even the highest buyin tables are nothing but AIPF Bingo fests. Fun for what they are (entertainment of sorts) but not poker. WSOP is a little better, but still, you can be like me and LOSE over 16 Billion in a head's up hand to a runner runner and a guy explaining "it's just fake chips anyway."
Did you find a clear, tangible and cohesive point in there anywhere? If so, let me know. Point is, f* freerolls unless you have no other option. Even if this is just a hobby for you, how many hobbies do you know of that you can do for free? (A few, I'm sure, but not many and not if you're "serious" about it) So man up and deposit at least SOMETHING.
Only THEN do the real decisions come into play. Do I risk it all for this big GTD? Or do I play in small increments to "manage my bankroll"? Do I call this all in for all my chips with AK on a King high uncoordinated board? Or do I think there are better spots for me to more calmly and slowly accumulate chips?
Word of advice: WHEN you deposit and play for real, do so at smaller stakes. It doesn't HAVE to be smallest stakes possible. But it should be small. Fact is, unless you are "The One" and a complete anomaly, YOU ARE GOING TO LOSE. The sooner you come to grips with that, the better off you'll be. INVEST in your early years of LOSSES. They pay dividends in BIG WINS in the future if you approach the game correctly.
Watch KID POKER on Netflix if you haven't already and I challenge you to tell me that Daniel DOES become #1 money list if he hadn't gone broke soooo many times on initial trips to Vegas.
well I just took down a freeroll on betonline got $5.75 in the account now. Freerolls can be a good source to build a bankroll, you just have to be good at it. and not be like me I've cashed a bunch of times yes sure for a little amount but had I not bought in to some of the tournaments that'd all add up eventually if I just saved it. and I already watched Kid Poker, read an article comparing to horse players cause I do that to.
Almost everyone starts with a game of poker with a freeroll. But the tactics of the game on the MTT differs from the freeroll. You can take your bankroll to 50, and then try to move to the MTT. Do not use more than 1 \ 20, part of the bankroll .This rule of poker players. Otherwise you lose your bankroll and entice. Play from the beginning is very tight, look closely at the game.
redmast said:
This logic is what professional poker players use to sell their books, coach their sessions, gain subscribers or otherwise profit tangentially to the game, other than by their play in said game.
....then they turn around and bet half their net worth on a prop bet of whether the flop will be red or black.
Almost NONE of them got to where they are by doing this. There are exceptions, obviously, like Joe Cada. But people, mistakenly, think that because he was a circuit "grinder" for so long that Ryan Riess built up this way. Totally not true. He would have had more money to his name if he had simply pocketed his earnings as a dealer at the local charity hall than he DID have since he chose to play as often as he did. So he decided to basically risk it all and put (not all, but like 95-98% of) his roll on the line at the East Chicago WSOP Circuit Event. Sure there was probably some play good to go along with run good. But he NEVER gets in the position to take down the MAIN so soon if he doesn't come away with that all-or-nothing win when he did. Then at the final table in the MAIN he hits the deck harder than Jamie Gold did (since Jamie could win TELLING you he was bluffing when he was and you'd fold). As the saying goes, better to be lucky than good. Personally, I prefer both.
if you want to play freerolls then that is grande, but remember its a completely different game then a deposit tournament normally freerolls are designed to be faster and you enter push / fold poker sooner and as a result you lose more often with your races, there is also more people involved meaning you have to win more races to get a minimal ammount, its not easy starting from freerolls unless your talking about special freerolls like the freeroll club where you have fewer entrys and so can have lesser varience and win more frequently
ouch, coolered inside a large freeroll? or a freeroll club? xD
it really really sucks dont it but a cooler is a cooler which means we win more often cus we made the right call 🙂 and in a 5 minute MTT having 40BB is not that great unless nearly on final table is it now ^_-
it really really sucks dont it but a cooler is a cooler which means we win more often cus we made the right call 🙂 and in a 5 minute MTT having 40BB is not that great unless nearly on final table is it now ^_-
sillymunchie said:
meant would have still been around 40-50th place with 98 to go. So I would have cut both my place and my chips in half if I surrendered like I should have. I do this often enough for a coach to consider it a "leak" when I just CAN'T believe that he has me both outkicked AND the better redraw. It's basically a perfect storm and when you go to the flop head's up the chances of that happening are slim to none. MOST of the time you're either ahead and he has the better draw or vice versa. Obviously it's awesome when you call it down to find out YOU have both.
Totally sick hand from tonight, I tried to make a move with 34d and got one customer with more chips than me, both well stacked. When the flop blanked me but brought a four flush I decided to continue the charade and try to get credit for tpgk. He made a HUGE OVERBET going all in, and having me covered, I would have to go all in to call. Since I had undercards, I calculated my outs as being strictly limited to the flush coming through. Doing the quick math, I believe it was just barely the "correct" play which tells you if you call often enough in that spot you're likely either unprofitable or just slightly profitable. So it called for a fold. But I got stubborn and was sick of getting pushed around. I thought for half a second "he wouldn't go crazy like this with a better four flush, would he?" ... "nah" I call.
He flips over nut flush draw. LMAO. Because neither of us have a pair, my tourney is now on the line with exactly 6 outs twice (~25%). The turn brings a 4. River is a blank. More than double up my sorry, lucky ass. I just said "wow" in the chat. And actually, now that I'm remembering it, I think I had him slightly covered so I knocked him out because he definitely had some choice words for me and they were coming as an observer.
As one ump defiantly stated to Joe Maddon last year, "I may be bad, but at least I'm not doing it on purpose" LMAO
Why is a person's post count directly proportional to their ability to form coherent, logical, grammatically correct complete sentences?
Not singling any one person out or even suggesting that I am making fun of them. Since they have basically no information on their post info I assume there is a language barrier.
Not singling any one person out or even suggesting that I am making fun of them. Since they have basically no information on their post info I assume there is a language barrier.
Depends entirely on how much you can afford to 'spend'. If that's not a lot, then you don't really have a choice but to freeroll, but if not, go for the micro stakes. I only say this because anyone in your position doesn't want to be hanging around on the freerolls forever. You can build a bankroll far far quicker on the real stakes than the freerolls. They seem to help a bit in order to prepare for the micro stakes, but it goes without saying that only the micro stakes can prepare you for the micro stakes. GL
GeorgeF1234 said:
I wish that ACR/WPN "financial history" and "tournaments" tracking was more robust and not limited to a month at a time. Because I'd really like to be reminded of my biggest win at the $2 Jackpot. I feel pretty secure in saying that MOST of them that I played in were only worth $4. But, my appetite for winning those was directly proportional to the size of my account funds. Or to be even more clear, like any normal human being, I'm more excited to be playing for a bigger reward. Obviously I don't recommend starting with $2 and risking it all on a Jackpot. But you couldn't even if you wanted to (unless, of course, you strike a deal like 2 acr for paypal). So assuming you have to deposit a minimum of 10, 20 or 25, you have more than enough to F around with $2 Jackpots. Recently 3 people got to play for the max reward of 5k. NOW, it makes no sense because the numbers of the 3 don't add up to 5k, but whatever, not my problem.
Back in the good old days, there were enough entrants to have massive prize pools for even micro-sized buyins. Nowadays, it seems the only way to do this with MTTs is super sattys to sattys to big games. You technically could have won $58,000+ this week on ACR by getting in through a freeroll. That's even better than the $11 investment that Moneymaker made into his $2.5m win, only because he ended up TID. Everyone else earned the 10k+ to enter and cover basic costs. I was always blown away by the rungood/playgood of the guys that turned $1 into 7 figures all online. They basically had to come in 1st in like 5-6 consecutive tournaments to make it happen was incredible.
Nutcracker69 said:
I've never deposited any money and the most recent freeroll I've won was for $5 on betonline, and now i have $20, so I have more than .44 cents nutcracker lol. and the $20 I have now was from money buy in's not freeroll's. mostly 6 player sng 1 up's which they no longer have there and I'm pretty upset/mad about that. They made them 8 player tables! 😡