I get the impression that the live cash game sessions organized by poker sites—featuring pros—are primarily designed to make new players believe that poker is just gambling (in order to generate more rake). There’s no logic to the way they play.
I actually have the impression a lot of poker pros are just losing bums that aren't no where near profitable long term.....that's why so many of them have too have side hustles and do other things to make money besides poker. I mean just because someone can afford to play high stakes poker that doesn't make them a pro......many of them are just rich morons who can't even carry an intelligence conversation about a lot of topics. Some of stupidest things I've ever heard in my life on Twitter and other forms of social media and TV have been said by so called pro poker players. A turnip has more brain power then some of these guys.
While other pro players are very intelligent, smart and well spoken on a number of topics.
Cheers!!!
While other pro players are very intelligent, smart and well spoken on a number of topics.
Cheers!!!
Watching them playing so bad poker always makes me considering how big the impact of the variance is.
Most pros would bankrupt if they hadn't assure themselves more reliable source of income, while they are on top: sponsoring, advertising, teaching etc.
Most pros would bankrupt if they hadn't assure themselves more reliable source of income, while they are on top: sponsoring, advertising, teaching etc.
It is likely that you don’t fully grasp what professional players are doing, simply because you lack sufficient experience or skills. Alternatively, it is possible that the professional players you are watching actually lack the experience or skills compared to you. Either way, don’t waste your time—put it to better use by playing in our CardsChat freerolls! 🙂tigre666 said:
Keep in mind that a professional poker streamer needs to make the video—and the game itself—exciting.
Naturally, this can lead to some illogical play. The goal is to instill the idea in the audience’s minds that anyone can be a winner in this game. If you’re just playing for fun, there are always "play-money" games.
But make no mistake: poker itself has changed. Anyone following the playbook from 20 years ago can no longer be profitable. If you want to make a profit, you have to adapt to the way poker is played today. You have to learn to dance with luck and variance.
Naturally, this can lead to some illogical play. The goal is to instill the idea in the audience’s minds that anyone can be a winner in this game. If you’re just playing for fun, there are always "play-money" games.
But make no mistake: poker itself has changed. Anyone following the playbook from 20 years ago can no longer be profitable. If you want to make a profit, you have to adapt to the way poker is played today. You have to learn to dance with luck and variance.
The poker site always has to win, and it will always win. What we win is just a tiny fraction.
@tigre666 I get what you mean, and I have had that impression too sometimes.
When I watch those live cash game streams with pros, it does look crazy. They call with any two cards, they bluff huge, they play hands that make no sense. If a new player watches that, they will think poker is just gambling and you just need to be brave and lucky.
But I think there are two reasons why it looks like that:
1. It's for entertainment. The sites want big pots, big bluffs, and crazy hands, because that's what gets views. If the pros just folded for 3 hours and played only AA/KK, nobody would watch. So they play looser on purpose for the show.
2. They are playing very deep stacked, with money that doesn't hurt them as much. When you have 500bb+ and you are playing for content, you can make plays that would be terrible in a normal $0.10/$0.25 game with a 100bb stack. New players don't see that difference, they just copy the crazy plays and lose.
I don't think the sites are trying to make people believe poker is only gambling, but they definitely want action because more action = more rake and more views. It's business.
For new players, my advice is don't copy what you see on those streams. Learn solid fundamentals first, tight-aggressive, position, bet sizing. The fancy plays only work if you already understand why you're doing them.
Do you think those shows do more harm than good for new players?
When I watch those live cash game streams with pros, it does look crazy. They call with any two cards, they bluff huge, they play hands that make no sense. If a new player watches that, they will think poker is just gambling and you just need to be brave and lucky.
But I think there are two reasons why it looks like that:
1. It's for entertainment. The sites want big pots, big bluffs, and crazy hands, because that's what gets views. If the pros just folded for 3 hours and played only AA/KK, nobody would watch. So they play looser on purpose for the show.
2. They are playing very deep stacked, with money that doesn't hurt them as much. When you have 500bb+ and you are playing for content, you can make plays that would be terrible in a normal $0.10/$0.25 game with a 100bb stack. New players don't see that difference, they just copy the crazy plays and lose.
I don't think the sites are trying to make people believe poker is only gambling, but they definitely want action because more action = more rake and more views. It's business.
For new players, my advice is don't copy what you see on those streams. Learn solid fundamentals first, tight-aggressive, position, bet sizing. The fancy plays only work if you already understand why you're doing them.
Do you think those shows do more harm than good for new players?
Haha fair enough, I get why it looked crazy 😅tigre666 said:
In a freeroll I like to use it to try spots I wouldn't try in a normal cash game. On AAAKQ, there's almost no value hand left to call with, so sometimes a bluff there is actually about representing the one Ace or the Queen.
It doesn't always work, and I know it looks wild. But for me freerolls are for learning and testing, not just for playing safe.
What would you have done differently in that spot?
How do 'they' do that? How do they steer you to a certain section on the site?marco198121 said:
I've never had this experience! I open the site and then I click on the TAB in the main lobby to take me to the section I want to play on.
No site has ever taken me to anything but what I want to play... and I've played on MANY poker sites. (close to 50 in the past 20years)
You believe that the professional poker player who is actively streaming their games, is going to be playing something that is not +ev for them so that their game can appear to be more entertaining to their streaming audience? Their going to be playing in an illogical way just to get more people to watch them?Claudiunm said:
Personally the few streamers that I watch are the ones who are playing optimally and are winning players in the pool they are choosing to play in. (ie. Lowstakes MTT, Mid-stakes MTT, Low stakes cash game (Z00M style)). I want to learn from them. The only time I would consider watching a player who I felt wasn't near the top of the game would be to see player pool tendancies.
The amount earned from streaming is pretty small.
I can tell you why u quitted: Because cash games are tough in general. Tougher than donkaments. And u were most likely unprofitable in the long run and at some point had enough. Its as simple as that.thedarkman said:
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Ah, the "lobby"—you have to keep clicking and clicking until you finally reach the section you’re looking for. You’ve actually just proven my point. Look, I’m not calling you naive, but many people fail to see the obvious; just like in a physical store or a shopping mall, they place items that are easy to buy quickly—often on impulse—right near the entrance. That’s marketing. It’s well within their rights. It’s up to the individual whether or not to consume those things.Poker Orifice said:
Sorry Marco, I must admit I do not get what you are trying to prove... and its is actually pretty simple. Instead of talking about some general "marketing ideas" just show us the example.marco198121 said:
We play poker, we log in to the site to play poker.
This is GG Poker site header, the most popular these days, just after logging in - I just click what I want to play and play it - it does not "steer" me in any way. I do not have to click much. I also cannot imagine I log in and play something else I planned to, just because I was manipulated in any way.
Look at the initial menu that pops up—it’s still labeled "Poker." You’ve got "All-in or Fold," "Spin," "Mystery Battle," and so on—all of them highly addictive, enticing games that are easy to jump into, finish, and start again. A significant portion of the company’s profit comes from these fast-paced games. As you can see, if you want to find the tournaments, you have to go looking for them yourself—clicking around and navigating—but the things they present to you right off the bat, without you even asking, are primarily these addictive, enticing games—just as you helped me show by taking that screenshot. Thanks for the help.Mario7 said: