How to use late registration to your advantage?

EnzoRS94 · Jun 22, 2022

jordanbillie said:
Mathematically, you can use late registration to your advantage.

I register at the last minute of EVERY MTT I play, and I have ITM% and ROI%s that are higher than the average person playing from the beginning of the tournament.

The reason for this is that the early chip lead is highly overrated and does not correlate nearly as much as generally perceived to higher ROIs.

The highest correlate to ROI is the ability to play short stacked poker during the late stages (since all MTTs inevitably boil down to this dynamic).

This is why training with Hyper Turbo SNGs/small field MTTs, to understand short stacked play is highly valuable.

Learn how to survive with and play a short stack!!!

Once you learn this skill, you can slither into the MTTs last minute, get ITM first, and then make a move for a stack.

Good luck!

Agree 100% with you, mate! That's the most important skill to master.

dino · Jun 23, 2022

depends of the tourney.
If you enter PKO, I like to enter early, and get few KO before the bubble and ITM.
In regular MTT with late registration, if you want to save time you can enter like @jordanbillie suggest and make easy ITM.
Look at his few threads, that this tactic is highly profitable.
Of course, it will not be for everyone but for majority of players could be.
IMHO I did it quite a few times and cash out, so I made some profit from this.
It's not every game, since my AA/KK got cracked few times and I've got kicked out.

But, it's working.

rachelle2291 · Jun 23, 2022

Late reg is the way I sometimes do things just to shorten up the tourney. Tourney in my opinion are often too long

hilary antonik filho · Jun 23, 2022

When I play from the beginning, I'm against late registration, but when I enter at or near the end of the late registration and manage to come out with a winning hand, I'm all for it, the important thing is that you enjoy the re-buy and add-on.Good luck and good decision

Ketienne · Jun 23, 2022

Personally, I also always like to get in during the middle/end of the late registration period.
Just wait for double up with premium hand and you are already in the average not so far from the bubble while many participants have already been kicked out. Of course, this can also backfire. So depending on the buy in, I plan 1-2 bullets but go overall quite well with this method.

Often I play too loose when I'm in from the beginning and so I'm more able to concentrate on the essentials when I'm joining in a later period.

jordanbillie · Jun 23, 2022

Ketienne said:
Personally, I also always like to get in during the middle/end of the late registration period.
Just wait for double up with premium hand and you are already in the average not so far from the bubble while many participants have already been kicked out. Of course, this can also backfire. So depending on the buy in, I plan 1-2 bullets but go overall quite well with this method.

Often I play too loose when I'm in from the beginning and so I'm more able to concentrate on the essentials when I'm joining in a later period.

Exactly.

I use a 40% ITM% as my benchmark for such double up decisions. I'm actually ok taking a flip (which will practically guarantee a cash if I double up) with 40% equity (for example KQ vs A10 is fine!). I use this balance between playing tight and taking double up shots. Basically, I like to jam when I have a high likelihood that the jam will get through, but if I do get called I have the chance of still being only a 40% dog at worst. This equates to a roughly 40% ITM% but it is better than just passively folding until you get ITM first. You have plenty of chances at final tables/wins, because you are doubling up (or more) most times you cash.

AKQ · Jun 29, 2022

depends on if you like bubble money or not

if you came for first
then show up first

LuckyLadiv · Jun 29, 2022

If you feel lucky to enter 5 minutes before registration closes it is a good strategy with a short stack, you practically play all in or fold.

Matt_Burns88 · Jun 29, 2022

I tend to play quite tight in the early stages of tournaments, so big gains early on are rare for me. Late reg'ing can be a benefit if your biggest edge is in the 20bb-40bb effective stack size. But expect variance to be much higher, because you're often going to be to making a decision for your entire stack each time you enter a pot.

With PKO's late reg'ing is a bad idea and the later you reg, the worse it is. This is because if you late reg, you're unlikely to cover anyone else's stack, which makes it impossible for you to pick up bounties, while you also have very little fold equity because your all opponents cover you and are looking to take your bounty.

dreamer13 · Jun 29, 2022

Almost all poker rooms allow late registration, and in some cases very late. Therefore, you should worry not only about your strategy at the table, but also about when to sit at the table. The lower the ROI, which is determined by your skill level, the more buy-ins you should have in your bankroll, and the earlier you should register. The later you register for a tournament, the lower your ROI will be, which is associated with higher variance. You should also consider the variance that comes with registering late with shorter stacks.

makisaa · Jun 29, 2022

You can enter the tournament later from the start, but till the blinds and stack ratio is worth playing the game. If you enter later than that you are in a much bigger risk.

mushthebush · Jun 29, 2022

There are various theories and I agree with everything that's been said, but I personally don't find late registering profitable. So, I simply go with register before the tournament starts, otherwise I lose opportunities to grow my stack and avoid being run over by the blinds or be forced into playing what I wouldn't normally. I do not like to gamble, especially with speculative hands.

wengz2002 · Jun 29, 2022

For me not much big difference in late reg. But I prefer to enter late.
To be honest I don't like quite long late registration like over an hour. I prefer no late reg, in freeroll, no re-buy, no re-entry, no add-on!!!

johnnylawford · Jun 29, 2022

Felpss_ii said:
what is the best strategy for tournaments with and without bounties in terms of when to enter the tournament, when the late registrations are dating or so what is the tournament open?

IMO it depends a bit on your stakes -early stages of a micro you'll find people giving away chips. These players usually disappear well before the 9-10th level, so you can build a stack early with minimal effort. As you move up the food chain there's less of a skill gap between players, so you don't see nearly as many whacky plays and therefore less EV to be gained in the early stage of an MTT.

Also, never late register a bounty game -period. This is especially true in PKOs where you can make a ton of money from busting short-mid stack players close to the end of late reg, but you can only do that if you have them covered.

natsgrampy · Jun 29, 2022

jordanbillie said:
Mathematically, you can use late registration to your advantage.

I register at the last minute of EVERY MTT I play, and I have ITM% and ROI%s that are higher than the average person playing from the beginning of the tournament.

The reason for this is that the early chip lead is highly overrated and does not correlate nearly as much as generally perceived to higher ROIs.

The highest correlate to ROI is the ability to play short stacked poker during the late stages (since all MTTs inevitably boil down to this dynamic).

This is why training with Hyper Turbo SNGs/small field MTTs, to understand short stacked play is highly valuable.

Learn how to survive with and play a short stack!!!

Once you learn this skill, you can slither into the MTTs last minute, get ITM first, and then make a move for a stack.

Good luck!

I have used this strategy for a while. Although, in live MMTs, I will usually get in right at the start. I did notice that many very good players did late register at the wsop Colossus last week. Thinking back, these players had better stacks than me when they got in.

I was wondering, do you generally have a stack size in mind as to when you late register? I was thinking 20BB with one or two more levels of late registration.

Thoughts?

jordanbillie · Jun 30, 2022

natsgrampy said:
I have used this strategy for a while. Although, in live MMTs, I will usually get in right at the start. I did notice that many very good players did late register at the WSOP Colossus last week. Thinking back, these players had better stacks than me when they got in.

I was wondering, do you generally have a stack size in mind as to when you late register? I was thinking 20BB with one or two more levels of late registration.

Thoughts?

Great question and kudos for the observations you have made!

It's always a great idea to pay attention to what the very good players are doing.

Stack size varies depending on the structure but it is typically 10BBs at the last minute of registration for the regular MTTs on Chico. I will only last minute late register these ones if it is 8 max (not 6 max), as 10BBs 6 handed seems to be too little to work with. 10BBs 8 handed is fine, especially since Chico sits most late reggers together on their own table (this makes it easier to get away with pre flop steal attempts). I also will not register only 10BBs deep if a double up still leaves me outside of the money (for example 44 players are getting paid and I would need MORE THAN a double up to get into 44th place).

I also play a lot of rebuy/addon MTTs which I can last minute late register (right before the last rebuy/addon break) and get a full stack (rebuy immediately and addon) of 25BBs. These seem to be the highest ROI of any game I play (at least at the $1, $3, $4, and $5 levels).

Stack size is not really a consideration of mine normally, it's more that it plays a factor into my perceived ITM chances.

Every game I play, I take a look at the lobby and try to estimate my chances that I will cash. I have it to the point now in my memory, that I can quickly glance at the MTTs which are within the last 5 minutes of registration and determine if I should register or not. This is the critical aspect of the game that will improve your ROI drastically. Think about it: if you only register games that are easy to get ITM, you can simply get ITM first and then take your flips for building a stack.

With this being said, it's always a GREAT IDEA to work on your short stack game. Learn how you can work the small stack and linger around by timely small stabs or jamming in optimal spots.

OK, I hope this helps!

Edit: The answer to your question is that I last minute late register every game. Part of the math and why it works out is that I NEVER REENTER any MTT.

WellAA · Jun 30, 2022

Foxie12340 said:
Late registration can be good in bounty tournaments, I usually enter 20 minutes or so before the end. This helps avoid the donkey play at the first of the game.

I rather prefer those fish at the tournament begging.

natsgrampy · Jun 30, 2022

jordanbillie said:
Great question and kudos for the observations you have made!

It's always a great idea to pay attention to what the very good players are doing.

Stack size varies depending on the structure but it is typically 10BBs at the last minute of registration for the regular MTTs on Chico. I will only last minute late register these ones if it is 8 max (not 6 max), as 10BBs 6 handed seems to be too little to work with. 10BBs 8 handed is fine, especially since Chico sits most late reggers together on their own table (this makes it easier to get away with pre flop steal attempts). I also will not register only 10BBs deep if a double up still leaves me outside of the money (for example 44 players are getting paid and I would need MORE THAN a double up to get into 44th place).

I also play a lot of rebuy/addon MTTs which I can last minute late register (right before the last rebuy/addon break) and get a full stack (rebuy immediately and addon) of 25BBs. These seem to be the highest ROI of any game I play (at least at the $1, $3, $4, and $5 levels).

Stack size is not really a consideration of mine normally, it's more that it plays a factor into my perceived ITM chances.

Every game I play, I take a look at the lobby and try to estimate my chances that I will cash. I have it to the point now in my memory, that I can quickly glance at the MTTs which are within the last 5 minutes of registration and determine if I should register or not. This is the critical aspect of the game that will improve your ROI drastically. Think about it: if you only register games that are easy to get ITM, you can simply get ITM first and then take your flips for building a stack.

With this being said, it's always a GREAT IDEA to work on your short stack game. Learn how you can work the small stack and linger around by timely small stabs or jamming in optimal spots.

OK, I hope this helps!

Edit: The answer to your question is that I last minute late register every game. Part of the math and why it works out is that I NEVER REENTER any MTT.

Thanks for your reply
. I have used a very similar strategy on Chico for the sattelites. I have found games with about a minute of late reg left and 2 - 5 to the money. I'm going to give your strategy a try in some MTTs.

Andyreas · Jul 1, 2022

jordanbillie said:
I will only last minute late register these ones if it is 8 max (not 6 max), as 10BBs 6 handed seems to be too little to work with.

I did not really understand what you've been hinting towards with this sentence.

I tried to find a good tournament to late register and tried to follow your approach:
- late registration period nearly over: Check
- Paying range within a double up: Check

But I didn't pay attention to the table size which was 6-max. I usually play 9-max but when I joined the game, I started to realise why you don't late register with 10BB at 6-max tables:
You pay the blinds too often while waiting for a shove spot and see your stack going down too fast.

I ended up busting faster than I wanted but at least I learned something. 😅

jordanbillie · Jul 1, 2022

Andyreas said:
I did not really understand what you've been hinting towards with this sentence.

I tried to find a good tournament to late register and tried to follow your approach:
- late registration period nearly over: Check
- Paying range within a double up: Check

But I didn't pay attention to the table size which was 6-max. I usually play 9-max but when I joined the game, I started to realise why you don't late register with 10BB at 6-max tables:
You pay the blinds too often while waiting for a shove spot and see your stack going down too fast.

I ended up busting faster than I wanted but at least I learned something. 😅

Yes exactly! That's what I meant, that I don't last minute late reg the 6 max games (unless the buyin is tiny and I have no other games to play).

The "standard" games on Chico are 8 max, which I prefer.

padman400 · Jul 1, 2022

VERY Interested in this as getting sick of cash haha.

I like the idea of last minute reg cuz I do not have the time to play full MTT's. I cant play at Chico so what other sites offer decent last minute reg tournaments please.
I have $60 in ACR all won without a deposit playing CC freerolls when you could and some cash games. I do not have bitcoin so cannot withdraw as that is all that is offered to me. So would love to give this a go.

Looked at the lobby and very unsure of what I should be looking for tournament wise to late reg.. Any help appreciated.

jordanbillie · Jul 1, 2022

padman400 said:
VERY Interested in this as getting sick of cash haha.

I like the idea of last minute reg cuz I do not have the time to play full MTT's. I cant play at Chico so what other sites offer decent last minute reg tournaments please.
I have $60 in ACR all won without a deposit playing CC freerolls when you could and some cash games. I do not have bitcoin so cannot withdraw as that is all that is offered to me. So would love to give this a go.

Looked at the lobby and very unsure of what I should be looking for tournament wise to late reg.. Any help appreciated.

Yes! The idea is that you are only playing a long session when you are deep/making a FT run!

I'm slightly confused, are you going to play with the $60 you have on ACR but wont be able to withdrawal?

You could always create a BTC wallet once you build your BR up to $2,000!

ACR should have some decent options for you to try this out with. Just look for MTTs that seem very easy to get ITM at the time registration is closing. You will have to experiment with it to get the feel.

Good luck!

amartimes · Jul 1, 2022

Late reg is a bit risky and if it rebuy then a player can shove on possible hands just to get to average chips.

padman400 · Jul 1, 2022

jordanbillie said:
Yes! The idea is that you are only playing a long session when you are deep/making a FT run!

I'm slightly confused, are you going to play with the $60 you have on ACR but wont be able to withdrawal?

You could always create a BTC wallet once you build your BR up to $2,000!

ACR should have some decent options for you to try this out with. Just look for MTTs that seem very easy to get ITM at the time registration is closing. You will have to experiment with it to get the feel.

Good luck!

Haha yes if its hit 2K I might just try and get my head around bitcoin. Right off to have a look on ACR now

TeUnit · Jul 1, 2022

I still think you are better off playing from the start and having an opportunity to get chips from the fish before they are gone rather than jumping in at the last minute and hoping you get lucky with your short stack. If you are a short stack expert then why not just play short stacked tourneys?

How to use late registration to your advantage?

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