What’s a good ITM ratio?

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Psyanide14

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Hey all. I know we all want to win every tournament we enter but that’s not possible. Even cashing every tournament is unlikely (even the top pros).

So what is an acceptable ITM and FT ratio? In your opinions?

I think 50% cashing and 10% final tables would be considered quite good but maybe I’m way off. What do the more seasoned players think?



Edit: thinking about it I guess final table is tough to quantify as it’s easier with a 100 person tournament vs a 1000 or more so let’s just look at ITM.
 
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Poker can be fairly ruthless any ITM would be my answer lol.🙂
 
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50% !? I wish I could run like that. 😉 I would say 20% or around there is more reasonable.

ITM is a meaningless stat to me. ROI and hourly rate is what's more important.
 
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Psy,

I will try to find the article I read recently. If I can, I will post it here.

Basically, it said that the pros who cash 17-20% of the time are considered top performers. So I think setting a goal of 50% for yourself is a bit ambitious and probably not achievable. But, if you can get there - wow!
 
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ITM does not guarantee success in poker, staying in ITM leaves your ROI% very low, you need to play to get FT, when you get 2nd, 3rd, your ROI% increases a lot, and you win many buyin, get ITM only win only 1 or 2 buy in that will not make big hits in poker.
 
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I thought I heard something like 15% to 20% ITM is around what you wanna shoot for. Right? I'm thinking I might be looking more into tournament strategy since they are inherently softer games I've heard, plus all the practice with CC freerolls.
 
If you're able to maintain a 50% ITM ratio, you're either damn good or damn lucky. I'd would say 20 - 25% if you're looking to make it big.
 
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Id like 2 see ITM at least 66% of the time now as far as making final tables go 15% would be great when final table is made id like to take 1st 30% of the time that i do make it... hell what do i know i suck at poker
 
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I thought I may have been off with my 50% ��. That’s why I ask the more experienced people here.

I guess winning every tournament is unrealistic too? Lol.

Edit: I guess I was basing it on my experience with 888 freeroll that pays 771 places in a 2500 player pool. So that’s like 30%. Obviously you want to be ITM more often than the % that make it. So if 15% of people are ITM you want to cash more often than that.
 
1.5 to 2x the % of the field paid out is what most pros run in tourneys.

So if 1000 entered, 100 paid (10%) most pros (Good Winners) would cash 15 to 20% of the time.
 
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According to the number of tournaments you are playing, but 20% ITM is quite reasonable, although better to reach final tables lol.
 
Excellent question. And thank you Protential for that specific answer. I for one am trying to save my bankroll while I improve my game. My plan is to keep track of my progress on cardschat freerolls and be extremely conservative with my bankroll until I can hit that percentage of ITM in a month.
 
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Perhaps it is glass half full/half empty?

bstyles85 said:
50% !? I wish I could run like that. 😉 I would say 20% or around there is more reasonable.

ITM is a meaningless stat to me. ROI and hourly rate is what's more important.
Click to expand...


While my Roi is one of my best stats, the ones that bring me the most joy and bragging rights is that my worst 100 is something like -.61 and worst 500 stats is a positive $1.58. If you do not lose there remains only 2 possible outcomes and neither are bad. In my opinion a newer player should spend all their time reading, practicing, repeat until they are confident in those 2 stats to not trend downwards in the long run. Phil Hellmuth once gave advice to new players which was the same but more straightforwards. He said "give yourself a chance. Don't go broke in the 1st year." I say do not go broke ever.
 
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Hi all!

good day 🙂 :icon_sunn
Interesting question and interesting answers from CC colleagues :congrats:
The ITM talks about a part of the statistic, the higher the better, it depends on which tournaments you play. If you play tournaments that reward 5% of the participants and your ITM is 10%, you are above average. But if you play tournaments that distribute to 50% of the participants and your ITM is 30/40 then you are below. With ROI it is simpler and easier to understand if your game is profitable

Nature's luck for everyone :ac4::ah4:
 
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I think win/hr is a much more valuable metric. Your goal should not be to be the best min casher, but to be the best money maker.
 
50 is too much, around 20 looks more realistic, and the final tables are 2%
 
Psyanide14 said:
Hey all. I know we all want to win every tournament we enter but that’s not possible. Even cashing every tournament is unlikely (even the top pros).

So what is an acceptable ITM and FT ratio? In your opinions?

I think 50% cashing and 10% final tables would be considered quite good but maybe I’m way off. What do the more seasoned players think?



Edit: thinking about it I guess final table is tough to quantify as it’s easier with a 100 person tournament vs a 1000 or more so let’s just look at ITM.
Click to expand...

aj1300 said:
Psy,

I will try to find the article I read recently. If I can, I will post it here.

Basically, it said that the pros who cash 17-20% of the time are considered top performers. So I think setting a goal of 50% for yourself is a bit ambitious and probably not achievable. But, if you can get there - wow!
Click to expand...

I think we either read the same article or watched the same video - because I remember seeing/reading the same, although I think the number was 18%.

I also think it may have been in reference to Justin Bonomo's crushing run a while back, how he was essentially destroying the average winner stats. I can't remember exactly.

Anyway - as stated by others FT - even more importantly top 3 finishes is a much better stat to track. Thats where all the monies are at - what allows us to increase our rolls.

Hitting the cash - for + 2-4 buyins is nice, but not something that will allow us to make any substancial withdrawals, nor play any larger event, until they have cashed in that same event consistently over numerous months - playing on a daily basis.

GL
 
I recognized you by your username, we were sitting at the same table plenty times, so we play on the same, similar level. Maybe my opinion is more relevant.

I was curious about the ITM, as well. Generally, I agree the ITM is not important stat opinion, the ROI and hourly earn are the important, but in our case the ITM is more important than it looks like.

In the same poker room, one of the best player has all time 22.8% ITM, one of the low, mid stakes 10K+ profit/ year player has 30.1% in this year.

Mine is 5% higher than yours, obviously it is because I rebuy a lot, sometimes way over I should.

However the main problem for both of us, I think, the final table results, you do not reach the top 3, and win enough, me neither, even top 3 is okay, I can win 20 few percent of the heads up, even I know, I am not good in that, it should be higher, and the significant difference about money, ROI is there.

Anyway, your ROI is half of mine, but still higher than mid, high level players - even the 2 guys mentioned above by the ITM -, but it is obvious, there are less hobby, bad player up there.

You should focus for the FT results, play. Do not worry if you relegate in the money early or in the FT bubble, because that does not make much difference in our level, case.

By the way, your November looks pretty good until now, generally your autumn. Congrats!
 
in general im around 40% in MTT, but is because im very meticulous and have tons of patience, and im very good exploit others players overplays and mistakes due the fact be playing micro and small stakes tournaments, but all depends what type tournament a player plays, but in general between 25% to 35% in MTT at long run is pretty good!
 
for MTT between 15-20%. people who give a higher number have no clue. More inportant how often do you make the final table! if u play chicken just to hit ITM. you never hit the big bucks
 
Psyanide14 said:
Hey all. I know we all want to win every tournament we enter but that’s not possible. Even cashing every tournament is unlikely (even the top pros).

So what is an acceptable ITM and FT ratio? In your opinions?

I think 50% cashing and 10% final tables would be considered quite good but maybe I’m way off. What do the more seasoned players think?
.
Click to expand...

Depends on field size, ITM is expected 10-20%, but final tables is what we are mostly interested in, especially top 3 finishes. If you are higher than 20% ITM you probably need to be playing more aggressively to build a bigger stack to final table more.


Your ROI is what is important, and that depends predominantly on your frequency of FT and top 3 finishes.
 
Thats kinda high numbers even for the pros, there numbers are in the 25 percent but they play bigger buy ins too which makes a way more profit to stake. The guys that play more probably have a better chance of cashing. Good luck and hope ya crush it.
 
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