MicroCrushers Thread!!!!!

[AlfieAA]

low at the range that i assigned to call us. TP or better or flush draws (again highly unrealistic but whatevs)



lets say we have 5c6c on a 10s 7s 2h board. his calling range has all combinations of flush draws and 10x (plus sets 2pair)



now if we change the board to 10s 7c 2h. suddenly his calling range consists only of 10x (sets and 2pair).



so in the lfush draw example we can bet blank turns and rivers expecting folds (or IP we could check back turn and bet blank rivers) and get folds.



but in the dry board example the absence of draws means that his range is so much stronger we can give up with an exploiting range.

for example (105/106/108/109/10J) can all just give up now (if for some unknown reason we have them preflop but you get the point.)

Yeah I think I understand it now duggs, thanks for explaining...I interpret it all as giving villian a pre flop range based on vpip then giving him/her a range based on what action they take from what position,,,then when the flop comes and depending if I'm in or out of position I will re access the range based on the flop texture, their previous action, position and their current action if IP...if a loose passive fish limps in MP and I raise x4 on the BTN and he flats and the board comes Tc 3d 7d then he could have a Axd or Kxd hand or a suited connector....not sure if a fish would play Q5d so I would take them out his range...and ofcourse I would put small/medium pairs, all broadways, 1 gapper suit/offsuit type of hands in his pre range.....then would try and work out my equity based on the flop texture and his pre limp/calling range and would decide whether or not I'm getting good value or implied odds based on what I've got and take it from there....then I would further narrow down ranges on 4th and 5th street based on actions and cards fallen...yeah that's where I'm at, at the moment in my game, its nothing special, but I'm adding bits and bobs all the time, and everything that's being said in here from you and the other guys is getting drilled in...who needs a training site when I have you guys

 

[duggs]

slight error in there alfie, you work out their preflop range. then you work out what parts of his range call which parts fold and which parts raise, the relative likelihood of each, and our equity v the two ranges that dont fold.

 

[Ducky7]

For your viewing pleasure:

scourrge and pocketehs 10nl session review 3-20-13 - YouTube

(Go easy on us, first time trying something like this )

Listen to their lol accents

 

[xdeucesx]

Listen to their lol accents

Scourrge has a great accent

edit: u jelly ducky?

 

[AlfieAA]

slight error in there alfie, you work out their preflop range. then you work out what parts of his range call which parts fold and which parts raise, the relative likelihood of each, and our equity v the two ranges that dont fold.

Ty mate, more good points that I've started doing, just never articulated it very well lol...thanks buddy, gave me a few thing to think about and work on for next week

 

[OMGITSOVER9K]

Listen to their lol accents

right?!

gonna watch it now, been laughing for the last 5 mins lmao (at their accents)

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Listen to their lol accents

Scourrge has a great accent

edit: u jelly ducky?

<3 ty deuces <3

right?!

gonna watch it now, been laughing for the last 5 mins lmao (at their accents)

Hey man - my voice is f***in' soporific. Deal with it!

 

[pocketehs]

anyone interested in a copy of leakbuster? selling super cheap

 

[AlfieAA]

I think I've got leakbuster on my hem1, but I've never really used it and I dont even know if I've got the full version or if its just a limited that's part of hem....but if someone can explain how it works and if I can use it seperate or combined with hem then yeah...I would be interested in giving leakbuster a shot....

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Alfie, I made a vid of me 1-tabling HUD-less but not much happened cause the Players/Flop was like 4% lol. Lemme know if you wanna see it though and I can ship it on Skype.

 

[AlfieAA]

Alfie, I made a vid of me 1-tabling HUD-less but not much happened cause the Players/Flop was like 4% lol. Lemme know if you wanna see it though and I can ship it on Skype.

That's great man, I'm up for watching that, doesn't really matter if you played many hands, its the other things that matter too like what your thought process is when you're not involved in hands....do you switch off and look at the tv or do you study the table and pick up bits of info for later etc....I will go on skype in a couple of hours or you can just put it on our youtube channel...whatever you thinks best man

 

[Matt Vaughan]

That's great man, I'm up for watching that, doesn't really matter if you played many hands, its the other things that matter too like what your thought process is when you're not involved in hands....do you switch off and look at the tv or do you study the table and pick up bits of info for later etc....I will go on skype in a couple of hours or you can just put it on our youtube channel...whatever you thinks best man

Not putting it up on the YouTube channel b/c like I said it's soooo little going on. I think in the 30 minutes I recorded there were only like 7 or 8 flops seen? So tbh there's so little going on. I may try again some other time on a looser table.

 

[AlfieAA]

Not putting it up on the YouTube channel b/c like I said it's soooo little going on. I think in the 30 minutes I recorded there were only like 7 or 8 flops seen? So tbh there's so little going on. I may try again some other time on a looser table.

Sure, no probs, I will have a look later then, see ya on skype in abit

 

[orangepeeleo]

HOTM

PokerStars - $0.25 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $14.24
Hero (SB): $28.14
BB: $24.69
UTG: $27.64
MP: $10.99
CO: $24.79

Hero posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.25

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.35) Hero has A:heart: A:spade:

UTG raises to $0.75, MP raises to $10.99 and is all-in, fold, fold, Hero calls $10.89, fold, UTG calls $10.24

Flop: ($33.22, 3 players) 8:diamond: 4:club: 7:diamond:
Hero bets $17.15 and is all-in, UTG calls $16.65 and is all-in

Turn: ($66.52, 3 players) 6:club:

River: ($66.52, 3 players) A:diamond:

[spoil]Hero shows A:heart: A:spade: (Three of a Kind, Aces) (Pre 76%, Flop 88%, Turn 89%)
UTG shows J:club: J:heart: (One Pair, Jacks) (Pre 19%, Flop 11%, Turn 8%)
MP shows K:spade: A:club: (One Pair, Aces) (Pre 5%, Flop 1%, Turn 3%)
Hero wins $64.52
[/spoil]

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Hey guys, Jake and I are planning to do another vid, but this one will be a HH review where we will go street by street and talk about the ranges we are giving people.

Any ideas or preferences on what type of hand/concept we should focus on? Ideas we've had so far:

- 3bets
- Facing 3bets
- Potential squeeze spots
- Cbets
- Facing cbets
- MW pots

 

[orangepeeleo]

I'd be interested in some 3betting discussion, both facing and 3betting if poss

 

[AlfieAA]

What about doing a little piece on equity and expected value sums based on the ranges you give villians.....and also I would like to hear you guys explain aggression factor/percentage in a hand so I can understand it abit better lol...infact why dont you guys make a whole series, and cover everything

 

[orangepeeleo]

What about doing a little piece on equity and expected value sums based on the ranges you give villians.....and also I would like to hear you guys explain aggression factor/percentage in a hand so I can understand it abit better lol...infact why dont you guys make a whole series, and cover everything

I dont even look at AF/freq fwiw, takes ****ing ages to be any use, i mean its on my HUD but I dont think I've checked it once.

Just an observation, but you seem like your trying to take in too much at once, just keep it simple at 5nl and add things gradually as you learn a new topic, like decide you'll concetrate on iso'ing limpers for a week and just do nothing but concentrate on that, when you feel like your doing it automatically with no thought, then move on to something else, its called the inchworm learning model, jared tendler talks about it all the time in his book and podcasts and it is a perfect way to learn almost.

 

[Matt Vaughan]

I'd be interested in some 3betting discussion, both facing and 3betting if poss

What about doing a little piece on equity and expected value sums based on the ranges you give villians.....and also I would like to hear you guys explain aggression factor/percentage in a hand so I can understand it abit better lol...infact why dont you guys make a whole series, and cover everything

Def leaning toward 3bet pots for the types of hands to focus on.

Alfie, are you talking about doing math at the table? Cause that type of calculation is great for off-table analysis and improving our intuition about spots, but most people won't be capable of incorporating a lot of mathematical analysis at the table imo.

Also with regards to the AF/frequency, it doesn't converge that quickly (compared to VPIP/PFR) and you can infer a lot of the info it gives you from other stats (like VPIP/PFR). Plus I find that a lot of people sort of tend to misuse it, and say something like "because villain has X AF, I'm gonna do Y" when really it's a stat best used in conjunction with other stats. Plus if you don't understand the algorithm the software specifically is using, it's not that helpful as a stat cause you don't really know what it means.

 

[AlfieAA]

I dont even look at AF/freq fwiw, takes ****ing ages to be any use, i mean its on my HUD but I dont think I've checked it once.



Just an observation, but you seem like your trying to take in too much at once, just keep it simple at 5nl and add things gradually as you learn a new topic, like decide you'll concetrate on iso'ing limpers for a week and just do nothing but concentrate on that, when you feel like your doing it automatically with no thought, then move on to something else, its called the inchworm learning model, jared tendler talks about it all the time in his book and podcasts and it is a perfect way to learn almost.

I couldn't agree more with ya peels, that's what I've been doing, although deffo did that more a few months ago when I was getting the basics down....I spent a week on starting hands then the next week working on understanding position and so on...so as it stands now I've got the basic fundementals down, mixed with the 'feel play'....now I'm working on the math side, which I'm thinking will take me more than a week lol, but once I understand that abit better I think everything else will be easier to learn....and like you say, I will just do 1 thing at a time...learn it, understand it, apply it then start with the next thing...could easily spend a year learning even just the intermediate stuff....its such a complex game, I would never have thought that 7 months ago when I was playing for fun on zynga lol....thanks man nice post

 

[AlfieAA]

Def leaning toward 3bet pots for the types of hands to focus on.



Alfie, are you talking about doing math at the table? Cause that type of calculation is great for off-table analysis and improving our intuition about spots, but most people won't be capable of incorporating a lot of mathematical analysis at the table imo.



Also with regards to the AF/frequency, it doesn't converge that quickly (compared to VPIP/PFR) and you can infer a lot of the info it gives you from other stats (like VPIP/PFR). Plus I find that a lot of people sort of tend to misuse it, and say something like "because villain has X AF, I'm gonna do Y" when really it's a stat best used in conjunction with other stats. Plus if you don't understand the algorithm the software specifically is using, it's not that helpful as a stat cause you don't really know what it means.

Yeah, absolutely I agree with you, the numbers side of the game should be done off the table, then it becomes sort of intuative on the table once you do it long enough....its prob unrealistic to work out all the numbers while your playing...prob best just to work out where you think you are with ranges/actions while your playing and all the other stuff will be known in the background of your mind without thinking about it much....I'm not at that stage yet, but I'm guessing everyone else ITT can do that sort of stuff......

Yeah that's true with agg factor/%, you would need a decent amount of hands/history with a player for you to take it into account with other stats like you say, so its gonna be hard giving examples with small samples....ah well, even just talking about this stuff and getting corrected helps me understand it all a little more.....


Anyway yeah, maybe concentrate on 3bets and isolation then, they are interesting topics

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Don't put yourself down so much alfie. I guarantee very few people itt do so much off-table math work that it's consistently informing all their actions (myself included obv).

There's a reason not many people do it - it's not easy!

 

[pocketehs]

Not sure if ppl have heard of this but just came across it and thought id share.

Turn betsizing to set up stack for the river..

Bet size = (Remaining Effective Stacks – Existing Pot)/3

Example. 30bb pot, ESS = 90bbs

(90-30)/3 = 20bbs

30 + 20 + 20 = 70bb pot on river with 70bb ESS on river

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Not sure if ppl have heard of this but just came across it and thought id share.

Turn betsizing to set up stack for the river..

Bet size = (Remaining Effective Stacks – Existing Pot)/3

Example. 30bb pot, ESS = 90bbs

(90-30)/3 = 20bbs

30 + 20 + 20 = 70bb pot on river with 70bb ESS on river

Well that's only if you want a pot-size shove, and also, you could figure this out with SPR, but I guess it's a helpful formula especially if you don't want to guesstimate when you have your timer running our

I prefer something like:



Here's my steps/process below. Lemme know if I made a mistake.

RiverBet = ESS - TurnBet
RiverBet = X%*RiverPot
RiverPot = TurnPot + 2*TurnBet

Known: X% (percentage of the pot we want the river shove to be), TurnPot (current pot size), ESS (effective stack size)

ESS - TurnBet = X%*(TurnPot+2*TurnBet)
ESS - TurnBet = X%*TurnPot + 2X%*TurnBet

ESS - X%*TurnPot = (1+2X%)*TurnBet
TurnBet = (ESS - X%*TurnPot)/(1+2X%)

or perhaps easier to read:

Bet Size = (ESS - X*Potsize)/(1+2X)

where X is the fraction of the pot we want the river bet to be. I checked my work by setting X to 1, and you get the same thing as pocketehs equation.

 

[Cafeman]

If I can somehow do it on the fly I prefer to work out a turn bet for a river shove that is less than pot size, so, you know, they feel 'priced in'