Fold AA

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DanyDiablo said:
whould you pocket AA pre-flop ?
If you do? In what situations would it be?
Good hands
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In a cash game you would never fold AA preflop. If you have multi players post flop and are OOP, I would fold to a coordinated flop that villain's may connect with. Remember, the more players that see the flop the less equity you have, hence the saying you may win a little or lose a lot.
 
MishkaZL said:
Personally, I can not imagine such situations. I would never fold my pocket aces.
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I like how under your screen name you are labeled as "Visionary" and your reply indicates that you simply cannot envision a scenario where you would fold AA preflop when there clearly are situations where that would be a wise thing to do lol...
 
I would never withdraw from such a strong hand on pre-flop, in fact I would without hesitation bet my entire bankroll on that hand😀
 
I play cash games, so of course not.
Quite a strange question, apparently you do not have enough experience in the game if you ask it. These are basic things.
 
frost234 said:
I fold AA when playing at the final table of the tournament and I had a short stack. Climbed 1 step higher ))
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Not sure if this was a joke I would never fold in a
situation as the short stack unless the money was substantial like 1000s as the short stack you desperately need a double up so the passing up the chance of a triple up if there was two or more all ins before me would be a mistake in my opinion yes you could bust out but I'd take this spot every single time not sure many would pass this up
 
Fivefor said:
I like how under your screen name you are labeled as "Visionary" and your reply indicates that you simply cannot envision a scenario where you would fold AA preflop when there clearly are situations where that would be a wise thing to do lol...
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..... it is really hard for me to predict such a situation .... probably because I have little experience .... so far.
 
sanych said:
I play cash games, so of course not.
Quite a strange question, apparently you do not have enough experience in the game if you ask it. These are basic things.
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If you're strictly a cash game player, it would be an odd question, but clearly, you don't have experience in playing satellite tournaments based on your remark. That's common sense that folding AA pre-flop on the bubble of a satellite tournament, where you have absolute nothing to gain, but could risk losing out on the prize. Here's a scenario.

26 people left, 25 spots win a seat to a bigger buyin tournament. You are 15th in chips, so comfortably in a spot to win, and the short stacks left are going to be all-in in the upcoming orbit. You are seated at a table (full ring) with 2 of the top chip stacks at your table, and you have 2 people that are on life support to win. You get dealt Aces pre-flop, the big stack (who has you covered) shoves pre-flop, are you SERIOUSLY going to call and risk losing? Sure, you're 80% against all pocket pairs, but are you going to risk losing 20% of the time to win a seat where your probability of winning is 99%?

Do the math, it would be a terrible call to make, and to quote you "This is a basic things".
 
DanyDiablo said:
whould you pocket AA pre-flop ?
If you do? In what situations would it be?
Good hands
Click to expand...
Preflop i would only fold in 2 cases .
1 If I'm in a satellite and I am already qualified , there is no point in playing the hand and it's an easy fold .
2 If i have like 1 or 2 big blinds and I'm on the bubble , and i can make it into the money by folding . Because if I double my stack it doesn't matter to much because i will still be a super short stack with 5 blinds maximum , but the min cash is more important in my opinion .
 
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I had a situation where I folded pocket aces near the bubble knowing I have enough chips to make it in the money and thankfully I'm glad I did as other players were at showdown where one player hit his trips with 6 6. Any other time i dont fold pocket aces.
 
Shumkoolie said:
If you're strictly a cash game player, it would be an odd question, but clearly, you don't have experience in playing satellite tournaments based on your remark. That's common sense that folding AA pre-flop on the bubble of a satellite tournament, where you have absolute nothing to gain, but could risk losing out on the prize. Here's a scenario.

26 people left, 25 spots win a seat to a bigger buyin tournament. You are 15th in chips, so comfortably in a spot to win, and the short stacks left are going to be all-in in the upcoming orbit. You are seated at a table (full ring) with 2 of the top chip stacks at your table, and you have 2 people that are on life support to win. You get dealt Aces pre-flop, the big stack (who has you covered) shoves pre-flop, are you SERIOUSLY going to call and risk losing? Sure, you're 80% against all pocket pairs, but are you going to risk losing 20% of the time to win a seat where your probability of winning is 99%?

Do the math, it would be a terrible call to make, and to quote you "This is a basic things".
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We did not consider satellites and tournament poker, the question about the AA hand was asked in the Cash Game section, look more closely
 
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Shumkoolie said:
Aces in PLO are vastly different than in Hold'em, and to take it one step further, not all Aces in PLO are equal. AAKK double-suited is a MUCH better hand than AA72 rainbow.

So you would never fold them pre-flop if on the bubble of a satellite to a larger tournament where your seat is secure if you fold, but you risk busting on the bubble????
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Good point - if my seat were completely secure I would fold, BUT, that's a really unlikely scenario to be in a situation where your seat is guaranteed.

AAKK in PLO double suited - I wish!
 
I did it many times in early games, not knowing each people how they play and many other factors made me think it shouldn't be a smart move to go all in in a big tournament that has just started. Ofc there are other scenarios but for me this one that I told you is the most important. Also in the bubble, it can be harsh playing aces. Haha
 
In a cash game, two aces do not fold pre-flop. There is no reason for doing that.
This way of asking the question is appropriate in tournament poker.
 
ronn6583 said:
In a cash game, two aces do not fold pre-flop. There is no reason for doing that.
This way of asking the question is appropriate in tournament poker.
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This. Game-based theory would suggest there are 0 times when it's a winning strategy to fold aces pre. Of course if 8 people go all in before you it's going to be a crazy hand and your chances of winning are lower with every person that is in the pot but you are still the favourite 😉
 
sanych said:
We did not consider satellites and tournament poker, the question about the AA hand was asked in the Cash Game section, look more closely
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I did see where it was posted, and I agreed with not folding Aces pre-flop in a cash game. There's absolutely no instance where doing that is sound strategy. But, asking alone in a cash game for the purposes of discussion makes for a really dull thread, so why not expand it to tournament situations, where the answers are more variable.

I do have a cash game situation for you though. Remember the Loose Cannon in the PokerStars Big Game where he was up $140k and he said he was going to fold every single hand pre-flop to lock up his winnings? Well, he got dealt Aces pre, and folded, and GOOD thing too, because Phil Laak would have busted him when he flopped Quads.

Here's the video - hopefully you can see it.


What do you think of that play? In a regular cash game, NEVER, but this is a unique situation, being on TV, playing in a once in a lifetime game, UP $140k, which for me at least, is BIG money. I don't blame him for folding, though he did get his share of people saying he shouldn't have folded, regardless of the results, because remember that you can't be results oriented.

Rowdy Greg said:
Good point - if my seat were completely secure I would fold, BUT, that's a really unlikely scenario to be in a situation where your seat is guaranteed.

AAKK in PLO double suited - I wish!
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If you play enough satellites, you'll see this situation, where you get Queens, Kings, Aces, and you are in a situation similar, and the strategy of folding in that spot pre wod still apply.

LOL!!! AAKK double suited in PLO sucks after 3 callers, and the flop is 3 unders, with a flush draw, and it's not either of your suits.
 
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The only situation for me to fold a AA pre-flop would be on the satellite with the guaranteed spot.
 
Shumkoolie said:
I do have a cash game situation for you though. Remember the Loose Cannon in the PokerStars Big Game where he was up $140k and he said he was going to fold every single hand pre-flop to lock up his winnings? Well, he got dealt Aces pre, and folded, and GOOD thing too, because Phil Laak would have busted him when he flopped Quads.

Here's the video - hopefully you can see it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nwCOOnA4vk

What do you think of that play? In a regular cash game, NEVER, but this is a unique situation, being on TV, playing in a once in a lifetime game, UP $140k, which for me at least, is BIG money. I don't blame him for folding, though he did get his share of people saying he shouldn't have folded, regardless of the results, because remember that you can't be results oriented.
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This fold is still ridiculous and uncalled for in my opinion although I understand why he did it. There's $5,200 in the pot when action gets to him. He's sitting on $140k and has said he's folding out the last 40 hands or whatever. Everyone knows he has a monster when he tanks. Why not just blast it or even jam rather than folding. Laak isn't calling to set mine if he raises to something like 14k+ and 9 times out of 10 he scoops a $5k pot. When he does get called or raised he's got 80% and should be able to know what boards are trouble. I understand being in over your head but I'd like to think I could adjust the other way rather than folding the nuts in a cash game. It's also a once in a lifetime opportunity to double up 140k 80% of the time.
 
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c0rnBr34d said:
This fold is still ridiculous and uncalled for in my opinion although I understand why he did it. There's $5,200 in the pot when action gets to him. He's sitting on $140k and has said he's folding out the last 40 hands or whatever. Everyone knows he has a monster when he tanks. Why not just blast it or even jam rather than folding. Laak isn't calling to set mine if he raises to something like 14k+ and 9 times out of 10 he scoops a $5k pot. When he does get called or raised he's got 80% and should be able to know what boards are trouble. I understand being in over your head but I'd like to think I could adjust the other way rather than folding the nuts in a cash game. It's also a once in a lifetime opportunity to double up 140k 80% of the time.
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He couldn't jam in that game. Pre-flop, the game plays Pot Limit, post-flop, No Limit. So, even if he pots pre, Laak's never folding in that spot.

Yes, you're 100% right, I agree with how absurd the fold was, but to protect that profit, which was life changing money for him, but I don't blame him for making the play because you're right, 80% of the time, he will add to the stack, but he's protecting the 20%, which, in his mind, he felt that he had more to lose. Nobody's ever folding 66 pre-flop to a pot-sized raise, and you saw how much of a tellbox he was that hand, that even if he potted after the hollywooding, Laak's going to know what he's holding, which is all the more reason to set mine.
 
Shumkoolie said:
He couldn't jam in that game. Pre-flop, the game plays Pot Limit, post-flop, No Limit. So, even if he pots pre, Laak's never folding in that spot.

Yes, you're 100% right, I agree with how absurd the fold was, but to protect that profit, which was life changing money for him, but I don't blame him for making the play because you're right, 80% of the time, he will add to the stack, but he's protecting the 20%, which, in his mind, he felt that he had more to lose. Nobody's ever folding 66 pre-flop to a pot-sized raise, and you saw how much of a tellbox he was that hand, that even if he potted after the hollywooding, Laak's going to know what he's holding, which is all the more reason to set mine.
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Didn't know it was pot limit pre. That does change things. What's pot then? Like 9.2k? It is very possible Laak can call with those implied odds but he could also fold. Without being able to make it at least 12k it does make it much more uncomfortable to play. Yea if Laak calls he ends up loosing at least 50k that would be super gross after saying you were folding till the end.
 
DrazaFFT said:
Why would you fold AA preflop in cash game? What action before your turn will make you think that youre not in a good position to put your money in?
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Your avatar goes perfect with your post/question. :icon_king
 
c0rnBr34d said:
Didn't know it was pot limit pre. That does change things. What's pot then? Like 9.2k? It is very possible Laak can call with those implied odds but he could also fold. Without being able to make it at least 12k it does make it much more uncomfortable to play. Yea if Laak calls he ends up loosing at least 50k that would be super gross after saying you were folding till the end.
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Yes, 9.2k sounds right based on my math too. Laak's likely not folding if David Fishman pots, though Mercier overcalling might influence a fold, but as it's a cash game, I'm thinking he's 90% to call anyway.
 
Never

I have never folded A_A pre-flop before, is this the strongest pair in poker? Is not it? Who would think of throwing that hand away? Funny :five:
 
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