Las Vegas shooting:64 year old Gunman Stephen Paddock kills over 50 people

rifflemao said:

Liberal Redneck - On Guns - YouTube

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That's a pretty smart redneck! BTW, I didn't realize there even was such a thing as a liberal redneck.

dakota-xx said:

What makes me angry are the people who think someone is not honoring the victims when they discuss the issues that lead up to it happening and what we can do to fix them.

If I am ever killed by one of these sick madmen with assault weapons - please honor me by having these discussions.

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I certainly hope you are not speaking to me. I only say this, as your comment followed mine. I do not want to trivialize the tragedy with my comments, as I said. I feel like making some emotional responses to many posts in this thread, but it is not about me or my emotions. It is about a tragedy and the real victims.

Discussion about what we can/should/need to do to avoid this is not only necessary, it is urgent. My comment was pertaining to me personally, and my emotional state after another tragic and senseless situation such as this, and me wanting to simply acknowledge the situation, without personally - and emotionally - chiming in.

If I came across as not honoring anyone, than my post was massively misunderstood.

I thought it was obvious that it wasn't you that Debi was referring to Jay.

And you are spot on that this is an urgent discussion that your country need to have, it was right after the Port Arthur massacre that we Aussies said enough was enough and we took action.

:top:

Zorba said:

I thought it was obvious that it wasn't you that Debi was referring to Jay.

And you are spot on that this is an urgent discussion that your country need to have, it was right after the Port Arthur massacre that we Aussies said enough was enough and we took action.

:top:

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You are most certainly right. I just saw the comment immediately following mine, and I probably jumped to conclusions. I guess I felt my comment could be interpreted as a criticism about discussion, as it was not meant to be. I am sorry about that.

I don't see why there is any issue with these crimes sparking discussion about gun control or anything else. I think it's a stupid, NRA-backed, social-media spread, talking-point that people like kid are regurgitating to say otherwise. It doesn't make any sense. Talking about gun control doesn't lessen the tragedy in any way.

Having said that, I do believe there is room for debate. I don't believe we should let Congress make a snap judgment based on a rare incident where we just give up more freedoms in the name of safety. We have done this in the past (Patriot Act) and we'll never regain the freedoms lost.

Now you might argue that these types of killings are not rare and it's long past time for someone to act. I can't really argue. I just think that there needs to be intelligent debate on what those actions should be and the potential consequences. The problem is that we don't have intelligent debate anymore. We have shouting matches, special interest groups who feel that giving an inch is just the first move on the way to running a marathon, and elected representatives who only care about their next election and where they're going to get the money for it.

I'd love to see the U.S. fix our money in politics problem and institute term-limits to deal with career politicians. Then maybe we can let people who are free to actually represent their constituents, not the special-interests, tackle the country's gun problem. As long as our current system is in place and the NRA holds so much power I just don't think it's possible.

For the record, I'm pro-gun but I feel we need to do something.

Well said sir, at least you as a gun enthusiast just like I am see that something needs to be done, I can only input what I see that has happened here, even before the gun laws were tightened here we didn't have the mentality that we were entitled to firearms.

fletchdad said:

I certainly hope you are not speaking to me. I only say this, as your comment followed mine. I do not want to trivialize the tragedy with my comments, as I said. I feel like making some emotional responses to many posts in this thread, but it is not about me or my emotions. It is about a tragedy and the real victims.

Discussion about what we can/should/need to do to avoid this is not only necessary, it is urgent. My comment was pertaining to me personally, and my emotional state after another tragic and senseless situation such as this, and me wanting to simply acknowledge the situation, without personally - and emotionally - chiming in.

If I came across as not honoring anyone, than my post was massively misunderstood.

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My comment was random and had nothing to do with your post - would have quoted you if so.

I made it as a result of the people making such statements in FB.

dakota-xx said:

My comment was random and had nothing to do with your post - would have quoted you if so.

I made it as a result of the people making such statements in FB.

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"Just cause you are paranoid doesent mean...."

Lol.. Thanks, I appreciate the shout. As I said above, I jumped to conclusion due to the timing and order of the posts. I should know by now you are not cryptic if you want to let someone know something.

And I also fully agree with you, even though I was not ready to start discussing when I made my first post ITT. I have learned over the years (and there are now a lot of 'em) to speak from cool and calm states, and not when I am liable to let the heat of my emotions speak. I still dont always make it, but I try.

The feeling of utter helplessness is so frustrating. Our government is NOT taking steps to insure this will cease to happen, actually just the opposite. And there are people who actually say stuff like "This is simply the cost of freedom"... and that makes me want to puke. Whats free about having to send your kids through a metal detector before they go to school? Whats free about deciding to not do something you like (such as attending a concert) because you are afraid of this happening again?

Obviously, if someone wants to reap destruction, and they know how to fly under the radar, they probably will. But for the people of a country to claim that weapons of mass and fast killing should be everyone's right to own is just so sick.

There can be change, but even if we all start now ("we all" meaning the people who WANT change) it may happen in my grandchildrens lifetime. No, I dont yet have any.

But it will be worth the wait and effort.


(and just to clarify..... Our government has not been moving in the right direction to prevent such happening for many years, even though the need for such has been apparent to even grade school kids. I feel the US has never had a more incompetent leader as we do now, but my statement above is not directed solely at the present regime.)

http://www.wnd.com/2017/10/paddock-prescribed-anti-anxiety-drug-in-june/

Paddock prescribed drug linked to violent outbursts
Use of anti-anxiety medication can sometimes trigger aggressive behavior, psychotic experiences


Diazepam can trigger “aggressive behavior,” “hallucinations” and “psychotic experiences,” which can be intensified by alcohol consumption, according to DrugAbuse.com.

“If somebody has an underlying aggression problem and you sedate them with that drug, they can become aggressive,” Dr. Mel Pohl, chief medical officer of the Las Vegas Recovery Center told Review-Journal. “It can disinhibit an underlying emotional state. … It is much like what happens when you give alcohol to some people … they become aggressive instead of going to sleep.”

According to a study published in the June 2015 World Psychiatry there is a strong correlation between a person’s risk of homicide and use of benzodiazepines. After examining 960 adults and teens convicted of homicide, the study found users of benzodiazepines have a 45 percent increased risk of committing homicide.

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Also from the news reporthttp://www.wnd.com/2015/06/big-list-of-drug-induced-killers/

WVHillbilly said:

I don't see why there is any issue with these crimes sparking discussion about gun control or anything else. I think it's a stupid, NRA-backed, social-media spread, talking-point that people like kid are regurgitating to say otherwise. It doesn't make any sense. Talking about gun control doesn't lessen the tragedy in any way.

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Obviously the only reason kid and those of similar mind set say it's "too soon"
is because we don't yet have a plausible "why".

And there is lies the root of the problem. We shouldn't be nearly as concerned about the "why" as we should
be about the "how"

Now just imagine if this guy was a shade or two darker or was the american born child of a
refugee family. No way would they consider it be "too soon".

When we focused on the "how" people were dying in car crashes, we made common sense
measures to still allow cars but to limit the fatalities

When we focused on the "how" people were dying in plane crashes, we made common sense
measures to still allow planes but to limit the fatalities

When we focused on the "how" people were dying from polluted air and water, we made common
sense measures to still allow air and water but to limit the fatalities

WVHillbilly said:

For the record, I'm pro-gun but I feel we need to do something.

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:top:
Personally I'm more "pro-logic"
I'm far from anti-gun, just anti-NRA fed bullsh!t

Zorba said:

Australians are still able to own and purchase firearms that have a design purpose other than killing humans, and hand guns are not available legally, and they are extremely hard to purchase on the black market, the number of hand guns here is minuscule and always has been.

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exactly. Black market weapons are at some point legally purchased and manufactured.

Just saw that the NRA has said that even they MIGHT be for regulating "bump stocks" (the part that allowed the Vegas shooter's gun to seemingly shoot like a full-auto). Now I realize this isn't an inch (maybe a millimeter) but I'm still surprised that they would even discuss it.

Guess maybe the bump stock manufactures aren't big donors?

WVHillbilly said:

Just saw that the NRA has said that even they MIGHT be for regulating "bump stocks" (the part that allowed the Vegas shooter's gun to seemingly shoot like a full-auto). Now I realize this isn't an inch (maybe a millimeter) but I'm still surprised that they would even discuss it.

Guess maybe the bump stock manufactures aren't big donors?

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Might being the key word here, not going to happen. Amazing at their (rightful) arrogance at saying they help to shape our gun laws.

belladonna05 said:

Might being the key word here, not going to happen. Amazing at their (rightful) arrogance at saying they help to shape our gun laws.

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Help shape? They straight-up write gun legislation and then tell their paid-for pols exactly how to vote.

WVHillbilly said:

Help shape? They straight-up write gun legislation and then tell their paid-for pols exactly how to vote.

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Fair point, I was trying to draw attention to what they said, not what they do

kidkvno1 said:

http://www.wnd.com/2017/10/paddock-p...-drug-in-june/ Paddock prescribed drug linked to violent outbursts
Use of anti-anxiety medication can sometimes trigger aggressive behavior, psychotic experiences


Diazepam can trigger “aggressive behavior,” “hallucinations” and “psychotic experiences,” which can be intensified by alcohol consumption, according to DrugAbuse.com.

“If somebody has an underlying aggression problem and you sedate them with that drug, they can become aggressive,” Dr. Mel Pohl, chief medical officer of the Las Vegas Recovery Center told Review-Journal. “It can disinhibit an underlying emotional state. … It is much like what happens when you give alcohol to some people … they become aggressive instead of going to sleep.”

According to a study published in the June 2015 World Psychiatry there is a strong correlation between a person’s risk of homicide and use of benzodiazepines. After examining 960 adults and teens convicted of homicide, the study found users of benzodiazepines have a 45 percent increased risk of committing homicide.

Also from the news reporthttp://www.wnd.com/2015/06/big-list-...duced-killers/

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Well this is pointless bullshit, you might as well say he had a nasty pimple that was hurting him and it was that that made him do it.

Did you even bother to read the link that you posted and think about what was said in the first sentence of that article you posted.

Paddock was prescribed 50 10-milligram diazepam tablets on June 21 and purchased the drug at a Walgreens store in Reno the same day it was prescribed

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His prescription was given to him and he had the drug prescribed to him on June 21st.



How many tablets do you think he had left 3 months later, and in that same article you posted it also says in the 4th paragraph that

Paddock was also prescribed 50 10-milligram tablets of diazepam by Winkler in 2016, the Nevada state monitoring report reveals. He filled that prescription the day it was written at Evergreen Drugs in Henderson

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Which goes to show that he was not a drug abuser or drug hoarder, unlike his stockpiling of inappropriate firearms which was a fact.



But instead you went to the straight to the sensationalist 5th paragraph in some kind of way to say it was the drugs and not his stockpile of weapons to sooth your own fixation with the medical world and all the nasty things it does and your blind obsession with the 2nd amendment being the be all and end all to the slaughter of your fellow countrymen. It is time to take the blinders off Kid.




This is what DrugAbuse.com actually says about that drug.


https://drugabuse.com/library/the-effects-of-valium-use/





Cherry picking to make a sensationalist point that fits with your argument is never a good thing.




I miss you on FB. if you don't like being challenged about the things you say you shouldn't say them.



:top:

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2016/06/10/faa-no-psychological-testing-needed-airline-pilots.html

The Federal Aviation Administration has ruled out requiring psychological testing for airline pilots in favor of enhanced mental health support programs in response to a crash last year in which a German pilot deliberately flew an airliner full of passengers into a mountainside, agency administrator Michael Huerta said Thursday.

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What would of happened, if that pilot, had crashed in to a town??

Psychological tests are ineffective because they reveal a pilot's mental health for only a moment in time without providing insight into whether the pilot will suffer problems later, Huerta told reporters at a news conference.

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for calling BS, on my other post, from the washingtonpost
Cops need to take a Psychological test, every year, but pilots don't need to take a test????

Does the member, Bearplay, come to mind??
Point of the post, is Stephen Paddock had a pilot's license and had owned two single-engine planes, what if he had done it, with a plane... He was not planning on taking his own life, that's why he did not use a plane.


http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/06/us/las-vegas-shooting-investigation/index.html

McMahill said police don't know what the killer was going to do with 50 pounds of explosives that were found in his car.

Paddock tried to buy tracer ammunition at a gun show in the Phoenix area in recent weeks, a law enforcement official briefed on the investigation tells CNN.

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The official explained that if Paddock had tracer ammunition, he could have had a more precise idea of where his shots were going in the darkness, and could have been more accurate.
Shooters wanting greater accuracy often mix tracer rounds with non-tracers -- perhaps having one tracer every fifth round in a magazine, said Art Roderick, a CNN law enforcement analyst.
"It allows you to keep your weapon on not necessarily a specific target, but a specific area. ... There would have been a lot higher casualty rate if he had tracer rounds," said Roderick, a former assistant director of the US Marshals Service.



A source close to the investigation told CNN on Friday that authorities think Paddock might have fired at massive jet fuel tanks at McCarran airport near the Mandalay Bay before firing on the crowd at the concert.

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There was initial speculation that Paddock had outside help in perpetrating the shooting spree, but authorities now say there is nothing to suggest he had assistance.
Law enforcement officials briefed on the investigation told CNN they have seen no indication so far that Paddock had an accomplice or that anyone was aware of his attack planning.
McMahill told CNN: "We didn't see anything that caused us to have concern that another individual would have been with him during (his time in the hotel)."

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In addition, in August, a person named Stephen Paddock reserved a room at Chicago's Blackstone Hotel during the city's Lollapalooza music festival, said Wagstaff Worldwide, which represents the hotel.
But that person never checked into the hotel, which overlooked the festival, Wagstaff Worldwide spokeswoman Emmy Carragher said.

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Zorba said:

His prescription was given to him and he had the drug prescribed to him on June 21st.



How many tablets do you think he had left 3 months later, and in that same article you posted it also says in the 4th paragraph that







Which goes to show that he was not a drug abuser or drug hoarder, unlike his stockpiling of inappropriate firearms which was a fact.



But instead you went to the straight to the sensationalist 5th paragraph in some kind of way to say it was the drugs and not his stockpile of weapons to sooth your own fixation with the medical world and all the nasty things it does and your blind obsession with the 2nd amendment being the be all and end all to the slaughter of your fellow countrymen. It is time to take the blinders off Kid.




This is what DrugAbuse.com actually says about that drug.


https://drugabuse.com/library/the-effects-of-valium-use/





Cherry picking to make a sensationalist point that fits with your argument is never a good thing.




I miss you on FB. if you don't like being challenged about the things you say you shouldn't say them.



:top:

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We don't, need to go back to the DR, to get a refill, refills can be set ahead for a year!! He was also drinking on top of taking the pills...

ISIS has reposted, that's it's behind the attack..


The news, is the bigger problem, the Bump stocks, that have been said in the news reports, are sold out, due to the news!
We need to stop, putting the mass shootings on the front page, with a photo of the SOB, who did it.

I'm not even quoting your rambling theories Steven. As a person who has been prescribed lorazapam in the past in america, no you can't. It's a class c drug and you can only get a certain supply ahead of time. You wouldn't know that as you don't go to the doctor and don't research what you yourself post. You have posted the fault lied with the NFL, drugs and other conspiracy laden posts. The fault lies with that fact that this terrorist murdered over 50 people with a stockpile of weapons that nobody needs to have. But that is what gun appologists do.

I've seen people take large doses of valium with alcohol and all it does it makes them pass out


Fwiw it was announced yesterday that so far this year another 51000 firearms were given up by the people here for destruction, most of these rifles were legal to own, their owners decided to get rid them during the latest amnesty.

.

😮

kid ramble said:

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2016/0...ne-pilots.html

kid ramble said:

The Federal Aviation Administration has ruled out requiring psychological testing for airline pilots in favor of enhanced mental health support programs in response to a crash last year in which a German pilot deliberately flew an airliner full of passengers into a mountainside, agency administrator Michael Huerta said Thursday.

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What would of happened, if that pilot, had crashed in to a town??

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And what would have happened if he instead bought a sh!tton of guns and shot up an outdoor music concert?
If he's white?
A lot of hand wringing and prayers for those who know those who were killed
and not a whole f#@k of a lot more than that...

kid ramble said:

for calling BS, on my other post, from the washingtonpost
Cops need to take a Psychological test, every year, but pilots don't need to take a test????

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And idiots that buy firearms enmass? How many times a year are they required to take a test?

PokerPete said:

And what would have happened if he instead bought a sh!tton of guns and shot up an outdoor music concert?
If he's white?
A lot of hand wringing and prayers for those who know those who were killed
and not a whole f#@k of a lot more than that...


And idiots that buy firearms enmass? How many times a year are they required to take a test?

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This is him everytime Pete.

belladonna05 said:

This is him everytime Pete.
View attachment 163689

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There's a medical term for that: A.D...O!L!S!

belladonna05 said:

This is him everytime Pete.
View attachment 163689

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PokerPete said:

There's a medical term for that: A.D...O!L!S!

Spoiler

Attention
Deficit
.
.
.
Oh! Look! SQUIRREL!!!

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Bullies.


:rock:

Condolences to the families of the deceased.

Allegedly. There are way to many inconsistencies in the whole scenario. I do not buy the way they have presented this at all. It is like all the other crazy stories about mass shootings that have happened in the past 20 years or so. Very little proof and a bunch of conjecture, sprinkled with lies and innuendo.

First of all, just ask yourself, what the hell did he need so many guns for and why did it take so long for the police to show up and where are all the spent casings, they show pictures of that room, did you see a pile of spent casings or any burns on the carpet? How was he able to put a video camera up without the casino noticing? Just exactly how did he get all those guns in his room without someone seeing it or suspecting anything?

Nothing adds up.