People shoving >50BB early on in a tournament

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I am getting sick of such action, when I have KK QQ JJ etc. and someone shoved before me it is a huge dilemma to call it not, even with AA is it good to risk 20% chance of going bust so early in the tournament?

The tournament starts with 50 BB and in a few hands a few people already have 100 BB or more.

P.S. it is not a freeroll, but a micro stake tournament.
 
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miklcct said:
I am getting sick of such action, when I have KK QQ JJ etc. and someone shoved before me it is a huge dilemma to call it not, even with AA is it good to risk 20% chance of going bust so early in the tournament?

The tournament starts with 50 BB and in a few hands a few people already have 100 BB or more.

P.S. it is not a freeroll, but a micro stake tournament.
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People play as they want to play, not all are as studied as you and a cheap poker game might just be a fun gamble for them.

It is frustrating but your approach should always be to find the highest EV outcome in each situation you are dealing with. It could well be right to fold JJ+ early on vs shoves, particularly if the pot may go multiway as people behind you try to 'bingo it up' too. Don't let the fact some people have doubled or trebled up early on distract you, concentrate on your stack and your game. You benefit from players gambling early on as they knock each other out taking unforced risks.

BTW are these rebuy tournaments? Some people will gamble very aggressively to build a big stack during the rebuy period (the strategy has a lot of merit too if done correctly). Avoid rebuys if you don't like the early mayhem?
 
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monkeytilter said:
People play as they want to play, not all are as studied as you and a cheap poker game might just be a fun gamble for them.

It is frustrating but your approach should always be to find the highest EV outcome in each situation you are dealing with. It could well be right to fold JJ+ early on vs shoves, particularly if the pot may go multiway as people behind you try to 'bingo it up' too. Don't let the fact some people have doubled or trebled up early on distract you, concentrate on your stack and your game. You benefit from players gambling early on as they knock each other out taking unforced risks.

BTW are these rebuy tournaments? Some people will gamble very aggressively to build a big stack during the rebuy period (the strategy has a lot of merit too if done correctly). Avoid rebuys if you don't like the early mayhem?
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I was knocked out early on when calling with JJ losing to TT at such a position.

Afterwards I started another tournament and got dealt AA at the very first hand, after I 3-bet a few people shoved - with AA it would be foolish to fold to anything pre-flop but at that point I would definitely have folded anything which was not AA. Eventually quadrupled up and I nearly won the tournament but played the head up phase badly and ended up losing an approx. 45-5 lead when 2 players were left.
 
Early tournament shoves for 50BB+ are almost always a sign of a very wide, unbalanced range, especially in micro stakes. From an EV perspective, you want these situations with hands like AA, KK, or QQ — even though the bust-out risk feels scary.

The key is separating tournament life fear from correct decisions. Early on, chips gained are very valuable and ICM pressure is minimal. Folding premium hands to avoid a 15–20% bust risk usually costs much more EV in the long run than it saves.

If someone is willing to shove 50–100BB early, they’re often doing it with weak holdings. You don’t need to match their craziness with marginal hands, but with true premiums, calling is almost always correct. Let them donate chips — variance will even out over volume.
 
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miklcct said:
I was knocked out early on when calling with JJ losing to TT at such a position.

Afterwards I started another tournament and got dealt AA at the very first hand, after I 3-bet a few people shoved - with AA it would be foolish to fold to anything pre-flop but at that point I would definitely have folded anything which was not AA. Eventually quadrupled up and I nearly won the tournament but played the head up phase badly and ended up losing an approx. 45-5 lead when 2 players were left.
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That's just tournaments, you got it in good, on to the next one. Hope you put a note on villain!

The big hand with AA sounds fine, main point overall is don't fear variance if a spot is +EV (just avoid risking it all on small +EV edges if you feel you can do well against the rest of the field). Correct Bank Roll Management avoids playing with 'scared money'.
 
I think they just want to build a big stack fast and probably expect to rebuy a few times trying to do that instead of languishing waiting for action. They roll the dice.
 
Baco said:
If someone is willing to shove 50–100BB early, they’re often doing it with weak holdings. You don’t need to match their craziness with marginal hands, but with true premiums, calling is almost always correct. Let them donate chips — variance will even out over volume.
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Why do they risk their tournament life with anything that is less than AA or KK? Even QQ when called by AK is a coin flip.

The only hand which is worthwhile to risk anything to double up is AA.
 
miklcct said:
I am getting sick of such action, when I have KK QQ JJ etc. and someone shoved before me it is a huge dilemma to call it not, even with AA is it good to risk 20% chance of going bust so early in the tournament?
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It depends, why you are playing. If you mainly play for fun and/or practice, maybe its better to preserve your stack and get involved in postflop play. However if you play for profit, then you should be happy to take any profitable spot, even if its high variance. This is, how I approach the game, so I would pretty much snap call with JJ+ and AK against that kind of action and be very happy about it. Occationally someone behind will wake up with QQ+, but you were likely not getting away from JJ or AK for 50BB anyway, so it is, what it is.

Also can you not reenter? Most MTTs give that option today. And if that is the case, why is it even a problem to bust early? If you can only afford to fire a single bullet at a microstakes MTT, then perhaps you should fix the financial situation, which cause this to be the case, before playing poker. Or you can work on becoming a winning player, so that eventually the game will pay for itself, and it will not an issue to fire a few bullets at a microstakes game. Our free course is a good place to begin to study poker strategy.

 
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I played Goliath for the first time 3 years ago, if you don't know it, its the biggest live tournament outside of vegas, played in Grosvenor Coventry and a £150 buy in at the time. I woke up with KK in around the 4th hand, players tend to call a lot so I raised 4X, got 3 bet, I 4 bet and the villain 5 bet shoved.....I considered folding as I was geneuinly concerened about AA at this point. I'd travelled 2 hours to get there and would have been going home if I lost, as I didn't have much of a live poker BR at the time, still don't.

I called for my tourney life, and the villain turned over ATo. I held, survived the day and went on to cash in my first big live tourney. It was my first score that gpt me on the Hendon mob. The point I'm making is similar to Fundiver, in poker in the end if you are not going to take the shot to make a big amount of chips with KK or QQ or AKs, what are you playing for, this doesn't mean play wildly or rashly, but when you know others are playing with a wide range, you have to take those spots, because they might not come around again in the tourney.

So there are no re buys in the tournaments you play, just play the next one! You have to try and remove the feelings about 1 individual tournament, and focus on making long term most profitable situations.

If I know, you will only play for 50bbs plus with AA I can simply 3 bet shove vs all your opens, other players dependent of course.
 
I think we complain when others do the same thing we like to do. Tell me you would not like a simple double up, then double that early in the tournament with premium cards. The complaint comes when we lose to a 3% chance of someone having a better hand.
 
I can't say it's a completely bad strategy
If you can watch 1:1 matches with good hands in the beginning, the winning rate is good
 
miklcct said:
The tournament I play is a sit and go which does not have an option to reenter.
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Ok but then presumably it runs regularly, so you can just play the next one.
 
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I played some low buy-in live MTT tournaments (5 USD) where some people went all in first hand without even looking at their cards...
It's a sort of play style where you want to double up early. I think mostly played by players who usually play higher stakes and who don't care about that "small" money just having some fun and build big stacks early.
 
miklcct said:
I am getting sick of such action, when I have KK QQ JJ etc. and someone shoved before me it is a huge dilemma to call it not, even with AA is it good to risk 20% chance of going bust so early in the tournament?

The tournament starts with 50 BB and in a few hands a few people already have 100 BB or more.

P.S. it is not a freeroll, but a micro stake tournament.
Click to expand...
It depends on how willing you believe they are to have a premium hand like AA. If it's a micro stakes event where everyone REALLY cares about min cashing, then a 50BB+ all-in is likely a NIT range of AA, KK and maybe AK etc. If they are treating it like a freeroll and you think they would go All-in with a maniac range, then you can probably Hero call it off with any pair if they are loose enough shoving; certainly high Ax holdings and maybe even any Ax holding.

It probably comes down to your willingness to bust (outdrawn or not) at the chance of doubling up early.
 
I mean you might as well ask is it good to be fold an 80% chance of winning....

poker is a game of odds, if you're scared to play you've already lost👍
 
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miklcct said:
I am getting sick of such action, when I have KK QQ JJ etc. and someone shoved before me it is a huge dilemma to call it not, even with AA is it good to risk 20% chance of going bust so early in the tournament?

The tournament starts with 50 BB and in a few hands a few people already have 100 BB or more.

P.S. it is not a freeroll, but a micro stake tournament.
Click to expand...
I can understand your frustration, been there,
 
Well, if you're afraid of going all-in with AA or KK hands, then you need to reconsider your approach to poker. Yes, of course, you can easily lose against 82 different suits, but if you're calling AA, I don't know what to call with.
 
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