*****Vinyl's GonnaCrushDAmicros 6max thread******

[vinylspiros]

How certain are you though?

What is a limp/call range for utg that 34s will play well against?

Q8s would play much better vs that range imo.

I have no idea what a limp call range would be for UTG because i never limp call so its kinda hard for me to think what kind of hand someone would do that with. I just assume its garbage most of the time, and try to narrow it down postflop.

 

[redwards92]

I have no idea what a limp call range would be for UTG because i never limp call so its kinda hard for me to think what kind of hand someone would do that with. I just assume its garbage most of the time, and try to narrow it down postflop.

The point is that we have a lot more equity vs any range with Q8s then we do with 34s(preflop).

Also we can discount AK and usually AQ in that KQ hand maybe not as much AQ as AK but there are 6 combos of AQ left + 3 of 44 then I guess JTdd as well.

We get value vs stuff like Ax and probably a few flush combos (SC type hands). Also I actually don't mind sizing on river now looking back.

 

[vinylspiros]

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Full Tilt Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

BB ($9.24)
UTG ($9.05)
MP ($9.17)
CO ($5.05)
Hero (Button) ($10.58)
SB ($8.29)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J

, 10

UTG raises to $0.30, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.30, SB calls $0.25, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($1.20) Q

, 4

, K

(4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $0.92, 1 fold, BB calls $0.92, 1 fold

Turn: ($3.04) 5

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.45, BB calls $1.45

River: ($5.94) 6

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $7.91 (All-In), Spot look good for a shove?

 

[Blobweird123]

How certain are you though?

What is a limp/call range for utg that 34s will play well against?

Q8s would play much better vs that range imo.

Agreed. His range for limp/calling has tons of smaller pp's that are crushing 34. Like ok so you feel good playing 43s because if flop comes out 422 you feel good that it only hit your range. But what about when villain has 55+?


Anyway

43: I just check back pre, fold flop
55: I prob 3bet river seeing as the only hand he reps that beats us now is 88.
KQ: Seems fine cept turn I'm going bigger for sure. Board gets a little scary and there's some rivers we'd rather not see and/or some rivers that kill our action. We get called by a ton of gutters/FD's/one-pair hands on turn. So bump it up! Allows more value on river as well.

 

[redwards92]

JTs hand

Not really.

We can fold most of his mid-pair and air type hands with a smaller bet. I ain't a math wizard but I think to continue this bluff profitably we need to bet smaller on the river.

I might be way off and just making shit up though so don't mind me :laugh: I probably just xb turn and send a quick one time to the poker gods 😀

 

[vinylspiros]

Agreed. His range for limp/calling has tons of smaller pp's that are crushing 34. Like ok so you feel good playing 43s because if flop comes out 422 you feel good that it only hit your range. But what about when villain has 55+?


Anyway

43: I just check back pre, fold flop
55: I prob 3bet river seeing as the only hand he reps that beats us now is 88.
KQ: Seems fine cept turn I'm going bigger for sure. Board gets a little scary and there's some rivers we'd rather not see and/or some rivers that kill our action. We get called by a ton of gutters/FD's/one-pair hands on turn. So bump it up! Allows more value on river as well.

I hear you blob. yea , maybe if im betting turn anyways, i guess im doing it for value so the sizing is a little off ,your right.

Yea 43 hand is one of those little moments i have here and there. Think im gonna stop posting those ones cause im -------------- correctly and thanks guys---------,taking alot of heat for them. I actually am going to stop messing around with those hands. My stats have gone from 19/13 to 24/17 and im not losing but i think its kinda taking its toll on my winrate. Just played more than like 70k hands this month( if im not mistaken) and am trying to mix it up a bit to see how it goes and maybe practice a bit on a more laggy style. But back to nit now.


thanks for tips though. always much appreciated.🙂

JTs hand

Not really.

We can fold most of his mid-pair and air type hands with a smaller bet. I ain't a math wizard but I think to continue this bluff profitably we need to bet smaller on the river.

I might be way off and just making shit up though so don't mind me :laugh: I probably just xb turn and send a quick one time to the poker gods 😀

Hehe thanks Reds.Much appreciated .

 

[Blobweird123]

I hear you blob. yea , maybe if im betting turn anyways, i guess im doing it for value so the sizing is a little off ,your right.

Yea 43 hand is one of those little moments i have here and there. Think im gonna stop posting those ones cause im -------------- correctly and thanks guys---------,taking alot of heat for them. I actually am going to stop messing around with those hands. My stats have gone from 19/13 to 24/17 and im not losing but i think its kinda taking its toll on my winrate. Just played more than like 70k hands this month( if im not mistaken) and am trying to mix it up a bit to see how it goes and maybe practice a bit on a more laggy style. But back to nit now.


thanks for tips though. always much appreciated.🙂





Hehe thanks Reds.Much appreciated .

If the roll can take it, then it doesn't hurt to experiment a bit, but just take baby steps. Don't be a nit, but don't just slam your foot on the gas and "become a LAG" lol.

Also JTs: What do we rep on river? Our range is very polarized to sets or air really. Like we either have QQ/KK/KQ and air, tons of air. So if villain is thinking at all, he's prob not going away with Kx a ton because he has blockers and at that point you rep like QQ and not much else.

 

[vinylspiros]

If the roll can take it, then it doesn't hurt to experiment a bit, but just take baby steps. Don't be a nit, but don't just slam your foot on the gas and "become a LAG" lol.

Also JTs: What do we rep on river? Our range is very polarized to sets or air really. Like we either have QQ/KK/KQ and air, tons of air. So if villain is thinking at all, he's prob not going away with Kx a ton because he has blockers and at that point you rep like QQ and not much else.

Well yea, i realize that. It's just that the way the hand went down with me peddling fast right from the flop and picking up outs on turn and peddling some more, i decided its all or nothing so im just gonna go for it. Felt like my line made sense ,along with the fact that he checked river as well. Its just wrong to give it up when river blanks. Couldn't do it.


Heres the result just for laughs. Obviously the desired one.😀 (not that it even matters,but you know)


Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Full Tilt Converter Tool from http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php

BB ($9.24)
UTG ($9.05)
MP ($9.17)
CO ($5.05)
Hero (Button) ($10.58)
SB ($8.29)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J

, 10

UTG raises to $0.30, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.30, SB calls $0.25, BB calls $0.20

Flop: ($1.20) Q

, 4

, K

(4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $0.92, 1 fold, BB calls $0.92, 1 fold

Turn: ($3.04) 5

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.45, BB calls $1.45

River: ($5.94) 6

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $7.91 (All-In), 1 fold

Total pot: $5.94 | Rake: $0.29

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero didn't show J

, 10

(high card, King).
Outcome: Hero won $5.65

 

[Blobweird123]

Well yea, i realize that. It's just that the way the hand went down with me peddling fast right from the flop and picking up outs on turn and peddling some more, i decided its all or nothing so im just gonna go for it. Felt like my line made sense ,along with the fact that he checked river as well. Its just wrong to give it up when river blanks. Couldn't do it.

Yeah you played fast on the flop onward, but what do you ever have here is all i'm trying to get you to think about. I know we focus on villains range. But we need to start looking at our perceived range as well. It's not too critical at your limit but even at 25nl the players start to look more at your range and the lines you take.

 

[vinylspiros]

Yea, i see your point . Well i guess i can have sets of K,Q and 4. Not much else i see myself repping here. KQ worse case scenario.


But i get what you mean yea. I really do focus on my percieved range. BUT and a big BUT, TBH, in this particular hand i didnt think about anything except how better and better the board was getting and how i was kinda glad he was calling ,untill river bricked along with my hopes.

thnk BLOB. For your overall help and contributions. MUCH appreciated.


And since tomorrow is the last day of the month and i wont be around cause im busy, im gonna post my monthly progress in a bit to see what ya boy vinyl managed to do this month playing 2,5 and 10NL.

Damn these micros, i just wanna get out of here.LOL

 

[redwards92]

you never have KK/QQ here because you flatted pre (maybe QQ I guess but doubtful)

so basically you rep 44 only and maybe KQ as well.

Our range for betting that flop is 44 + KQ then mostly air and semi bluffs(like blob already said I guess lol). Be careful with those seemingly big draws. We pick up more equity on the turn but not as much as you might think.

 

[vinylspiros]

THREAD UPDATE :

Ok, so month has come to an end as i wont be playing tomorrow cause its the weekend so time to do fun things.

Last month i self excluded myself from playing on stars for six months due to tilting my 200$ ish roll off in 5 minutes playing 100NL .

Next day i wanted to start fresh so gave FTP a try. Deposited 10$ and was left with 4$ on the 5th of february.


Decided to play some 2NL and play as good as i could incase i could turn it into something. Played strictly RUSH poker and grind went better than expected.


Current bankroll 353$.



Crushed 2NL for 30K hands with a profit of: 85$ ( this was pretty sick really cause its 2NL so im talking about a 43 buy in upswing,lol)
Did alright at 5NL for not too big of a sample winning: 66$
And then went pretty well at 10NL for 10K hands for a total profit of: 150$


Also won some cash through fulltilts fpp's as i achieved goldstar and i unlocked X amount of money every week or something.



Here are all my hands played this month. Hope i can make it to 25NL by mid march. Will be shot taking there when roll is over 500$ so its not going to be a walk in the park nor does anyone guarantee success but optimism is key.

Thanks to all the cash game beasts posting here and making this thread fun.



Here is what i got this month.

 

[Figaroo2]

Estimating ranges using the hud stats

Hey Vinyl
I was looking at the 43 hand and his line makes perfect sense with his likely holdings to me.
He bets at the flop to see if you have a queen and when you call he then checks it down to see if his 77 is any good. any decent bet by you on the turn would probably have taken it down. Once you have checked the turn he is likely to look you up on the river on anything up to half pot. I know i would.
Regarding using the stats to range people
The attachments show that he is PFraising with 8% so i have shown an 8% range.
His VPIP goes up to 27% so i have shown what that sort of standard range should look like. Then I have taken off the top 8% to leave you the range he is going to be in most often when he limps. There aren't that many queens in the overall mix so once he checks the turn i think it safe to assume he doesn't have a queen. If he does have one its likely to be suited. With this range you need to be more worried about aces and kings rather than a queen.
The 77 falls into the top 8% but he is utg and his range is probably a little tighter from there (maybe 5%?)
Hope this helps... and yes a very fishy player whos vpip pfr gap should allow you to fold when he raises unless you are also strong.

 

[vinylspiros]

Wow man. Thanks alot for breaking that down.Yea makes total sense to me and thats why i didnt bet river. I felt he either had an underpair or he had 2 overcards like AK which are the only hands i see it playing that way. In either case betting river is bad because if its the former hes not folding cause i checked turn and if its the latter, my pair of 4's has showdown value so not much valuebetting river ,is there? Thnkas alot for the charts and taking up so much time to make such a analytical post . Much appreciated.

 

[Figaroo2]

I made the post because you commented you were struggling to range people and this is a good way to do it. It really was my eureka moment with Hud stats when i was shown this method this way you can pretty much rule out AK as that is firmly in his 8%pfr and he would normally raise it up.

 

[duggs]

Except his stats won't be position invariant

 

[Figaroo2]

Except his stats won't be position invariant

Obviously as he is Utg you need to consider he is more likely at the strong end of the limping range or bottom of the pfr range and that turned out to be the case
as he had 77. It is of course just a guide and the reason why good players will occasionally limp and raise with unusual holdings to make them harder to read/range. As I've read often there is less of a need to vary your play at this micro stake. Im reading this guy as a standard loose passive who is unlikely to vary his play and you can range him with confidence.

 

[Blobweird123]

Vinyl stop showing results! It only hurts the HA.

 

[vinylspiros]

Vinyl stop showing results! It only hurts the HA.

True true. will do.😀

 

[micromachine]

Sick results man, keep it up!!

 

[vinylspiros]

Sick results man, keep it up!!

Couldn't do it without the help of everyone here . Thanks a lot bro.😀

 

[DrazaFFT]

Sick results Vinyl...
Makes me wanna delete my tread 😀

Keep crushing m8, this tread is great motivation for all of us!!!

 

[vinylspiros]

Sick results Vinyl...
Makes me wanna delete my tread 😀

Keep crushing m8, this tread is great motivation for all of us!!!

Your thread is awesome. Keep posting hands and getting feedback. You'll get there for sure. Thnks bro for kind words.

 

[vinylspiros]

anyone folding turn here?


villains stats: 42/27/1.3 10%-3bet 77 hands

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Full Tilt Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

CO ($10)
Button ($14.28)
SB ($10.69)
BB ($16.29)
UTG ($17.55)
Hero (MP) ($10)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J

, A

1 fold, Hero raises to $0.35, 1 fold, Button calls $0.35, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.85) J

, A

, 5

(2 players)
Hero bets $0.65, Button raises to $1.50, Hero raises to $2.35, Button calls $0.85

Turn: ($5.55) K

(2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $11.58 (All-In), Hero ?

 

[Blobweird123]

I expect to see 55 here with some regularity unfortunately. But why did we take our foot off the gas on the turn? We can't 3b flop then check a pretty innocent turn card. And by innocent I mean he doesnt have AK/KK here like ever with 10% 3b. So yea I think its a set here but depends if he would raise flop with AJ/AQ/A5. Im sure it cant be a call but in game I might.