Common mistakes I/You see in the CC freeroll players

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I like playing the CC freerolls. These aren't your normal freerolls. We see a lot of the same players over and over, so there is a bit more pride here in winning. The money is not why we are there (at least I don't think so).

Having said that, it is still a freeroll. There are still shoves that shouldn't be and calls that shouldn't be, but in the end there is nothing at risk and much to gain, so the "freeroll" gene takes over.

Because we are so familiar with some of the names, it is easy to tell when a new CC'er starts playing. It takes the new guys a little while to recognize that most of us to want to really play poker, rather than Bingo.

Good luck and God bless.
 
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NWPatriot said:
I like playing the CC freerolls. These aren't your normal freerolls. We see a lot of the same players over and over, so there is a bit more pride here in winning. The money is not why we are there (at least I don't think so).

Having said that, it is still a freeroll. There are still shoves that shouldn't be and calls that shouldn't be, but in the end there is nothing at risk and much to gain, so the "freeroll" gene takes over.

Because we are so familiar with some of the names, it is easy to tell when a new CC'er starts playing. It takes the new guys a little while to recognize that most of us to want to really play poker, rather than Bingo.

Good luck and God bless.
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I definitely agree that CC freerolls have nothing to do with the ones offered by some sites.
They might be a little similar during the first 30 to 45 minutes, but after that, the play gets tougher and you better play as serious as you can.
Like it's been said somewhere above, winning is more about prestige than money and the competition doesn't let you get there that easy.
 
NWPatriot said:
There are still shoves that shouldn't be and calls that shouldn't be
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Sometimes these discussions can make it sound like, as soon as people have to put up their own money, then everyone are playing perfect. But as anyone know, who have played any amount of micro and low stakes games, thats far from the case. Even in real money games there are lots of people playing for fun, gambling, drunk, tilting, whatever. Especially at the lower limits of course.

And thankfully so, because this is why, poker is still alive and beatable. This hand was played today at a 10NL cash table on ACR. The opponent 4-bet jammed for around 10 times the size of the pot with QJs risking 10 american dollars of his own money. I am pretty sure that hand selection or for that matter 4-bet sizing is not on any GTO charts from the main training sites 😉

CardsChat Poker Hands Converter
 
roger perkins said:
Ok this is a thread to discuss what I or You see in the play of our fellow CC freeroll players. This is not to point out any particular players but to hopefully help your and my game.
Common Mistakes as I/You see them. Agree or Disagree I/You may see things different so lets discuss.

The all in jam preflop when the blinds/pot is low. I see this a lot.

I think this is a big mistake for the following reasons.

1. You are risking usually 2000 to 3000 chips to gain less than 50 to 100. The risk return here is way to out of line. Also you failed to maximize the amount of chips you could have gained.

2. If called you are probably way behind or at best risking your tournament life on a flip before the tournament has even really started. Or maybe the caller is just looking to get lucky and maybe he will.

3. The winner of the tournament is never determined in the first levels and the winner is not the player that wins the most hands its the player that wins the most chips.
I remember a tournament I was in it was level 1 and about 400 players were in. One guy jumps up and yells "Yes I just tripled up". He didn't get ITM he didn't even make it to the second break.
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"The winner of the tournament is never determined in the first levels and the winner is not the player that wins the most hands its the player that wins the most chips." Absolutely correct. Just look at the standing after the 1st level. You will see familiar names up there all the time. They are frequently out if not in the top ten. The problem is look at the standing 1/2 way through the tournament and the money bubbly. They don't cash often as they should.



GeckoAA said:
When a person first plays a CC Freeroll its easy to think that they are just like any other freeroll and then play the all-in shove fest style but a person will soon realize that they are not like that at all. Those who have been playing CC games for a while take a lot of pride in treating the CC freerolls as a higher stakes type tournaments. To win is a very prestigious honour and I think thats more important to the CC folks than the actual prize is. So thats a game changer for freerolls. I know when I first started here, that was my biggest mistake 🙂.
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Cardschat freeroll as not as others for a good reason. People here for the most part want to learn and become better. To win our tournament is nowhere as easy as you would think as there are some very good players here.

Roller said:
Mistakes CC players most commonly make in the freerolls, not sure if their are mistakes per say. Many players play the freerolls for different reasons and a wide range of focus or concentration on the games and play. That being said taking them to serious may be the most common mistake.
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"That being said taking them to serious may be the most common mistake." I would disagree. Here we have people trying to become better in a safe environment where they can get funds to move up in the poker world. People should take the game more seriously here if they really want to improve. Now there is serious and then there is serious, and we should not go overboard on the seriousness of the game were playing but not taking the game seriously would be a mistake.



alien666dj said:
I notice mistakes like poor preflop, postflop play, lack of open raises, frequent limps, poor understanding of push-fold strategy.
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So true.


Justcall529 said:
Lots of freeroll players play way too many hands. Patience is a virtue.
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Some do play way too many hands that are not profitable, but patience is not a virtue in poker. If you're to patient you will not win in this game.


akmost said:
There are many good players in CC freerolls but the vast majority of them play only freerolls. If you don't ever play for real money you will never forced to study a tittle bit.

The mistakes I have noticed so far are similar with yours:

-Too much open limping with any two cards , not solid starting hands.
-Not awareness of the board texture / range advantage.
-Not awareness of the dynamic of the table / phase / line up , some players insist in playing only their strong hands.
-My favorite : donk betting vs early position open raise in dry boards / play out of position a lot -Small Blind- with any two. (I mean they will hit some times the jackpot but in the long run they lose).
-Open jam 150bbs? I guess those players will play with the same strategy in a paid game? Not!

Just my observations , I don't criticize anything or anyone here. It's a freeroll and every player participates for his own reason.

My only objection though is for the CC regulars who play for many years and they keep struggling and they don't understand basic strategy. You dedicate your energy and your time to the game and you are part of this wonderful community. If you have questions about your game just ask ,create threads with questions or spots, you will feel more comfortable at the tables and believe me by having good fundamentals you will win the real money games too.

Have fun everyone!
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"If you don't ever play for real money, you will never forced to study a tittle bit. " Not entirely true. Some people will for the love of the game and the hopes to someday have the chance to play for real. I did this after black Friday hoping the game would come back. What did this get me? Well a wsop seat in 2012 from a sub site. Won a few entry's into other tournaments in bar leagues and online including a free WSOP Circuit event.

"Open jam 150bbs? I guess those players will play with the same strategy in a paid game? Not" Sadly its rare that it happens but some do play this way in the casinos. Have seen a guy call blow $300+ in a cash game with Ten high call on the river and my favorite was the player who through my 3-bet jam over him and 2 callers was a bluff so calling a 30BB with K5s was the best move to make. Yes, i am still on tilt over that bad beat. I was drawing dean on the turn to his 4 of a kind. FYI, I had 2 kings. Sick



CaptainXL said:
I will sometimes raise or even call all in with a single ace and a decent kicker early in a freeroll. I like playing freerolls so I don’t usually do it, but if I’m at a table with much raising and calling all in the odds may actually favor it. Once I get platinum back I can always play tomorrow.
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I get your reasoning, but it does have a flaw. Yes, you can play tomorrow but don't you want to improve to be a better player. Our freerolls are great as players can play make some coin and work on improving there play.


mardi1987 said:
Players participating in the CC freeroll play differently from room to room. It also depends on the level of the game. At the bronze games you can see everything (eg GG) while on platinum on other sites, they play completely differently. I mention those two rooms since I played them lately ... There are a lot of players on GG who push any two, But for those three mistakes you listed, I totally agree.
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Yes the bronze games can be a bit wild and part of the reason I stopped playing them so much. Nothing like 6 players all in on the 1st hand and the 82o wins.

NWPatriot said:
I like playing the CC freerolls. These aren't your normal freerolls. We see a lot of the same players over and over, so there is a bit more pride here in winning. The money is not why we are there (at least I don't think so).

Having said that, it is still a freeroll. There are still shoves that shouldn't be and calls that shouldn't be, but in the end there is nothing at risk and much to gain, so the "freeroll" gene takes over.

Because we are so familiar with some of the names, it is easy to tell when a new CC'er starts playing. It takes the new guys a little while to recognize that most of us to want to really play poker, rather than Bingo.

Good luck and God bless.
Click to expand...

Agree out games are not like the normal ones. I do think its about the extra money for some but yes for many it is about the pride of winning one of our games,

"Having said that, it is still a freeroll. There are still shoves that shouldn't be and calls that shouldn't be, but in the end there is nothing at risk and much to gain, so the "freeroll" gene takes over." The problem with this thinking is it works against them. I have playes $1.00 game to $22.00 game online at times. The level of many of the players on this game is much better than what you would think. It may be a free roll but what going to happen with the coins you make here if you don't learn to play better? This is the error they are making when they go into freeroll mode.
 
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I've always maintained that patience will get you far, especially when it comes to freerolls , and especially, as you say, when it comes to the all-inners, at the beginning of freeroll, and low buy-in tournaments.

If you're a beginner, the best advice I can give, is to play low-level games, be patient, and watch how many people drop out at the beginning, because of the "all-in frenzy".

I'm not a Howard Lederer fan, but he made a very good statement: "Why put yourself out of a tournament at the beginning, when there's so many more hands to be played." (He said this in relation to live, and big money tournaments, but with freerolls, you can certainly see how this applies.

....and like you see, it's major risk for minor gain.
 
franken222 said:
I'm not a Howard Lederer fan, but he made a very good statement: "Why put yourself out of a tournament at the beginning, when there's so many more hands to be played." (He said this in relation to live, and big money tournaments, but with freerolls, you can certainly see how this applies.
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Actually I think, its just the other way around. Sure if you travelled all the way to Las Vagas to play the WSOP main event, then you probably dont want to put yourself out of the tournament at the beginning, because that would be a lost opportunity. You invested 10.000$ plus travel expenses, and it will be a full year, before you get another chance. So of course you want to make the best out of that investment and not punt away your stack in the early game, especially since reentry is not allowed.

But freerolls are the exact opposite. You dont need to wait a year to play the next freeroll, only a day or maybe a week, if we are talking about the CC freerolls. You invested nothing other than a bit of electricity to run your computer or phone. And its not like cashing in a freeroll will change your life in any way, shape or form. So it actually makes a whole lot of sense to put yourself out of the freeroll as fast as possible, because then you are not wasting your time grinding for pennies 😉
 
fundiver199 said:
Actually I think, its just the other way around. Sure if you travelled all the way to Las Vagas to play the WSOP main event, then you probably dont want to put yourself out of the tournament at the beginning, because that would be a lost opportunity. You invested 10.000$ plus travel expenses, and it will be a full year, before you get another chance. So of course you want to make the best out of that investment and not punt away your stack in the early game, especially since reentry is not allowed.

But freerolls are the exact opposite. You dont need to wait a year to play the next freeroll, only a day or maybe a week, if we are talking about the CC freerolls. You invested nothing other than a bit of electricity to run your computer or phone. And its not like cashing in a freeroll will change your life in any way, shape or form. So it actually makes a whole lot of sense to put yourself out of the freeroll as fast as possible, because then you are not wasting your time grinding for pennies 😉
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My question to you is why even play in a free role at all? If you don't want to grind for pennies and want to be knocked out early then why did you sign up for the free role in the first place? Even if you go all in and double up three times in the beginning you're still going to have to hang around until the end to make those pennies.
 
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Luvepoker said:
"The winner of the tournament is never determined in the first levels and the winner is not the player that wins the most hands its the player that wins the most chips." Absolutely correct. Just look at the standing after the 1st level. You will see familiar names up there all the time. They are frequently out if not in the top ten. The problem is look at the standing 1/2 way through the tournament and the money bubbly. They don't cash often as they should.

It's funny cuz I play a lot of live tournaments and that's exactly what I always looked at the leaders on day one are often the ones that don't ever make the money. I always look to the middle of the pack those are the ones that usually finish up high because they're playing a sensible game. Not saying that all first day leaders don't make the money but it usually turns out 80% of them never do. Most of the time in a CC freeroll when it's getting down to about the last 30 players I'm usually a little below average stack. But that doesn't bother me because I know and that is when people start playing differently because they see that ITM and that's usually when I chip up to make the final table run.
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the biggest mistake I see at CC is players who have been here for years and do not alter their game in any way.
over and over for years trying the same moves and almost always losing.

I am always shocked in real money games (micro) to see that most players are not as good as our CC freerollers.
 
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Luvepoker said:
"That being said taking them to serious may be the most common mistake." I would disagree. Here we have people trying to become better in a safe environment where they can get funds to move up in the poker world. People should take the game more seriously here if they really want to improve. Now there is serious and then there is serious, and we should not go overboard on the seriousness of the game were playing but not taking the game seriously would be a mistake.
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Levels of serious, exactly and if that's accurate then I correct my self and change my phrase. "That being said taking them "Way to Seriously" and that may be the most common mistake."

Each player may play any way they prefer and should be encouraged to do such, be it a freeroll or buyin. But no investment makes for no risk and all reward game, hence the style of play and lack of seriousness at times.
 
roger perkins said:
Ok this is a thread to discuss what I or You see in the play of our fellow CC freeroll players. This is not to point out any particular players but to hopefully help your and my game.
Common Mistakes as I/You see them. Agree or Disagree I/You may see things different so lets discuss.

The all in jam preflop when the blinds/pot is low. I see this a lot.

I think this is a big mistake for the following reasons.

1. You are risking usually 2000 to 3000 chips to gain less than 50 to 100. The risk return here is way to out of line. Also you failed to maximize the amount of chips you could have gained.

2. If called you are probably way behind or at best risking your tournament life on a flip before the tournament has even really started. Or maybe the caller is just looking to get lucky and maybe he will.

3. The winner of the tournament is never determined in the first levels and the winner is not the player that wins the most hands its the player that wins the most chips.
I remember a tournament I was in it was level 1 and about 400 players were in. One guy jumps up and yells "Yes I just tripled up". He didn't get ITM he didn't even make it to the second break.
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Yeah shipping it with ANY hand in the tournament when blinds are that small is not smart in my opinion and not how a player wins. If these players do win a tournament or get ITM then they’re few and far between! I know from experience! Hahah
 
Calling all-ins early in tournament with just a pair.

Playing way too many hands.
 
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what I see most are all-in preflop. At first I did this a lot, until I learned to better analyze the plays.
 
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roger perkins said:
The all in jam preflop when the blinds/pot is low. I see this a lot.
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I see this from players who want to double up early and are willing to gamble to do so (with the plan of more productive use of their time if they don't), and can reasonably expect to get called from other players who have similar motivations. They are valuing their time and money differently. So given their motivations I don't think it is 'bad', although from a pure expected value from within the game ignoring other considerations it is.
 
risking a 200 or 100 bb to win a 3 bb ;p
 
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mateuszjason said:
risking a 200 or 100 bb to win a 3 bb ;p
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I see that too many times

lcid86 said:
Calling all-ins early in tournament with just a pair.

Playing way too many hands.
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Beginners play
 
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Kudos to Roger for starting this thread & to all who are participating, excellent thread.



:congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats:
 
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LetterRip said:
I see this from players who want to double up early and are willing to gamble to do so (with the plan of more productive use of their time if they don't), and can reasonably expect to get called from other players who have similar motivations. They are valuing their time and money differently. So given their motivations I don't think it is 'bad', although from a pure expected value from within the game ignoring other considerations it is.
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If I have a plan for more productive use of my time why am I even wasting it entering the tournament? So okay I can learn French or try and double up in a tournament that apparently I really don't want to waste my time in? That being said even if you double up early so what. Are you now going to play better now, because the 2500 chips you just gained really don't make that big a difference. So you have 5000 chips you are still playing at a small blind level which is not the place to try and win the tournament or to try and leverage your big stack, which really isn't that big. In 4 or 5 levels what difference did that small gain accomplish? If you really are looking at improving your game use every hand, every bet and every level to learn and improve. IMHO
 
I agree with you on the early olay shove to win 100 or 200 chips..

Also yes an MTT is never won on the first levels that's for sure big swings can happen fast, sometimes i'm barely hanging to 3 or 4 BB then things get crazy and i end up winning the whole thing...
 
Thanks to all the contributors to this post. This has been one of the most interesting I have read in a long time. I actually read most all of the comments here. Usually I skim through some but thiese were really worth the look. Thanks again !!!
 
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This is one that all newbies to Cards Chat should read .
 
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Basically, the players in our community play at a pretty good level, but nevertheless, probably 20% of the players regularly play with junk. 😀
And in my opinion this is the main mistake. 🙂
 
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Garfield52 said:
This is one that all newbies to Cards Chat should read .
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I wouldn't be surprised though if someone watches this thread and actually takes notes how to play against specific individual ...
 
Calling Stations

najisami said:
I agree with what you pointed out and if I may, I'll add one common mistake I see all the time in those tourneys :
When a player has a big pair (JJ or better), they just keep betting (or calling) all the way to the river and don't hesitate calling a shove. They just can't fold their ONE single pair no matter what the board is.
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Yes I agree I see this a lot as well, players will see the flop with a small pair then if flop is all small cards they will jam??? Players need to understand that when you Jam/Shove, anything goes, your decisions are done and the result is up to the RNG......🙂🙂🙂
 
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