****December Destruction Chat****

F Paulsson said:

Oh sure, you need some hands. But that's just a matter of EV. It's true that you may spend 13.5K FPPs and not have anything to show for it but the EV is still higher.

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Pretty sure your hourly would still be higher in the 5400 FPP satellites. IIRC, the last time I worked it out, it came to like ~$100ish in EV after selling the T$. So 13.5k FPP's is worth about $250 in 5400 satty's. Not sure what your average time played for the SM is, but I'm pretty sure it's long enough that this decision isn't even close from an hourly perspective, since the EV of 13.5k FPP worth of 5400 satty's works out to about a 16% ROI in the SM.

Happy for what is usually the worst day of the week for me

GRMBLF!@$ dude is tight pre so I opted for a flat.
He is 5/5 for folding to cbets on the flop so I didn't have the stones to bet the river out AAARGH

Seat 1: entYy ($16.93)
Seat 6: BleArgH ($12.43)
Dealt to entYy [Jc Jd]
sensibel79 folds
lilouch59 folds
BleArgH raises to $0.35
94941AP folds
KilloKaddo55 folds
nfst folds
entYy calls $0.30
apu81 folds
*** FLOP *** [10h 4d Js]
entYy checks
BleArgH checks
*** TURN *** [5h]
entYy bets $0.40
BleArgH calls $0.40
*** RIVER *** [Qd]
entYy bets $1.00
BleArgH raises to $4.60
entYy raises to $16.18, and is all-in
BleArgH calls $7.08, and is all-in
Uncalled bet of $4.50 returned to entYy
*** SUMMARY ***
entYy shows [Jc Jd]
BleArgH shows [Kh Ad]
BleArgH collects $23.72

Biggest call station in the world and he stacks me 2 times

Seat 5: entYy ($11.82)
Seat 8: Mandrake6969 ($19.16)
binkie1967 posts the small blind of $0.05
entYy posts the big blind of $0.10
chalamar posts the dead blind of $0.10
Dealt to entYy [Qc 9h]
Mandrake6969 calls $0.10
Nels0n folds
chalamar checks
ZALACTORWIN calls $0.10
JB1974 calls $0.10
binkie1967 calls $0.05
entYy checks
*** FLOP *** [6c Qh 5d]
binkie1967 checks
entYy bets $0.60
Mandrake6969 calls $0.60
chalamar folds
ZALACTORWIN folds
JB1974 folds
binkie1967 folds
*** TURN *** [6s]
entYy bets $1.00
Mandrake6969 calls $1.00
*** RIVER *** [8c]
entYy bets $2.00
Mandrake6969 raises to $4.00
entYy calls $2.00
Mandrake6969 shows [9s 7s]
entYy mucked [Qc 9h]
*** SUMMARY ***
Mandrake6969 shows [9s 7s]
entYy mucked [Qc 9h]
Mandrake6969 collects $11.21

so much fun !

eNTy said:

so much fun !

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for the sake of your mental game, try not to make graphs after losing sessions (and limit the number of graphs you make in general). try not to look at your cashier too much either. delve into the game so you're only thinking about decisions and not the results/CC theads/anything else. if you can do this for an hour or two and you feel you played your a-game, unpost ur BBs, and finish your session without looking at your tracker/cashier etc. the next day, look through some hands you played where you felt you made mistakes in your previous session. look over the regulars you're going to be playing against. devise a plan to exploit them, open up some favorable tables, and start playing the same way you did before. if you do this for a week or so, you'll look at cashier and say "well, holy cow, look at how my good play led to profits!"

also just a fyi, when a calling station raises river, top pair is usually beat

can't beleive im managing to play breakeven poker the last 10k hands, i jsut can't stop getting coolered. Had a nice set<set and flush<fh to end last session. Its a good job im earning 8 fpp's an hour, ill tell you that for free

on wednesday, i'm going to start playing poker again!
for serious!

i might be playing busto stakes tho which will suck for a while

dsvw56 said:

Pretty sure your hourly would still be higher in the 5400 FPP satellites. IIRC, the last time I worked it out, it came to like ~$100ish in EV after selling the T$. So 13.5k FPP's is worth about $250 in 5400 satty's. Not sure what your average time played for the SM is, but I'm pretty sure it's long enough that this decision isn't even close from an hourly perspective, since the EV of 13.5k FPP worth of 5400 satty's works out to about a 16% ROI in the SM.

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+1 also sattys are rake free.

Only difference is that you can't win 6 figures in the satty plus the sattys are tilting as hell. Of course so is the million when you go on losing streaks.

Basically if you can get the $4k cash bonus I'd go for that. That's what I'm doing at least.

vanquish said:

mental game & results

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Thx for the advice man.
I try to do it but it's so hard. I almost never look at my cashier during sessions anymore. But I almost always refresh my Amount won in PT after a big hand which is basically the same I guess. I like to think I'm not but I'm probably very results orientated..

I'll try and cut back but it won't be easy.
I urge to see how I'm doing during sessions and making the transition to just playing my best for an hour or two then quitting is a hard one.

I usually end my sessions after I lost too much, or when I'm tilting, or if I'm up usually around the 1 hour mark. Unless I'm up quite a bit fast then I end it sooner.

eNTy said:

Thx for the advice man.
I try to do it but it's so hard. I almost never look at my cashier during sessions anymore. But I almost always refresh my Amount won in PT after a big hand which is basically the same I guess. I like to think I'm not but I'm probably very results orientated..

I'll try and cut back but it won't be easy.
I urge to see how I'm doing during sessions and making the transition to just playing my best for an hour or two then quitting is a hard one.

I usually end my sessions after I lost too much, or when I'm tilting, or if I'm up usually around the 1 hour mark. Unless I'm up quite a bit fast then I end it sooner.

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if ur serious about getting better at this, i can sweat u and show u some stuff that really helps. PM me

[cheapshot] or you could share sweat with someone who isn't busto [/cheapshot]

vanquish said:

for the sake of your mental game, try not to make graphs after losing sessions (and limit the number of graphs you make in general). try not to look at your cashier too much either. delve into the game so you're only thinking about decisions and not the results/CC theads/anything else. if you can do this for an hour or two and you feel you played your a-game, unpost ur BBs, and finish your session without looking at your tracker/cashier etc. the next day, look through some hands you played where you felt you made mistakes in your previous session. look over the regulars you're going to be playing against. devise a plan to exploit them, open up some favorable tables, and start playing the same way you did before. if you do this for a week or so, you'll look at cashier and say "well, holy cow, look at how my good play led to profits!"

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This has to be next to impossible! Seriously I can't not look at my stats in HEM or my cashier at least 3,765,893 times a session!!!

a therapist should do the trick

This I just lolled at
I'm past tilt woot.
On the other hand being on the right side of set over set is nice too.

3bet is on the small side, but I misscrolled

MP1: $10 (100 bb)
MP2: $15.35 (153.5 bb)
MP3: $6 (60 bb)
CO: $5.50 (55 bb)
Hero (BTN): $15.15 (151.5 bb)
SB: $13.75 (137.5 bb)
BB: $5.40 (54 bb)
UTG+1: $10.30 (103 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is BTN with K A
MP3 posts BB out of position, 3 folds, MP3 raises to $0.30, CO folds, Hero raises to $0.70, SB calls $0.65, BB folds, MP3 calls $0.40

Flop: ($2.20) 3 2 A (3 players)
SB bets $0.30, MP3 calls $0.30, Hero raises to $2, SB calls $1.70, MP3 folds

Turn: ($6.50) 5 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($6.50) T (2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero raises to $3, SB calls $2

Results: $12.50 pot ($0.60 rake)
Hero showed K A (a pair of Aces) and lost (-$5.70 net)
SB showed A T (two pairs, Aces and Tens) and won $11.90 ($6.20 net)

Jagsti said:

Oh baby!!!! I thought I was the only one who did this. I take it all the time, poops are so much more enjoyable when I'm reading this thread imo

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Sick....really, really sick

Jagsti said:

This has to be next to impossible! Seriously I can't not look at my stats in HEM or my cashier at least 3,765,893 times a session!!!

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^^^^^^^^^
Neither can Chuck Ts (its why he timed out on the set of queens) jk chuck jk

I never bother to look at my cashier until there is no $ left to reload with

Good run in the warm-up for $1200 so didn't play ring Sunday.

Did some studying of some stuff on Saturday and had a good run which carried on today.



Been quiet about things in here lately as going through a Rocky/A-team style training montage. Will emerge from the barn firing cabages from a drainpipe shortly.

ChuckTs said:

Anybody else get as much pleasure out of using your laptop on the pooper as I do?

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This has saved me many a time while playing a SNG or MTT. Nothing like making a raise while dropping a deuce eh?

Anyways another session of 200ish hands, another +12. I guess slow and steady wins the race.

eNTy said:

This I just lolled at
I'm past tilt woot.
On the other hand being on the right side of set over set is nice too.

3bet is on the small side, but I misscrolled

MP1: $10 (100 bb)
MP2: $15.35 (153.5 bb)
MP3: $6 (60 bb)
CO: $5.50 (55 bb)
Hero (BTN): $15.15 (151.5 bb)
SB: $13.75 (137.5 bb)
BB: $5.40 (54 bb)
UTG+1: $10.30 (103 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is BTN with K

A

MP3 posts BB out of position, 3 folds, MP3 raises to $0.30, CO folds, Hero raises to $0.70, SB calls $0.65, BB folds, MP3 calls $0.40

Flop: ($2.20) 3

2

A

(3 players)
SB bets $0.30, MP3 calls $0.30, Hero raises to $2, SB calls $1.70, MP3 folds

Turn: ($6.50) 5

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($6.50) T

(2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero raises to $3, SB calls $2

Results: $12.50 pot ($0.60 rake)
Hero showed K

A

(a pair of Aces) and lost (-$5.70 net)
SB showed A

T

(two pairs, Aces and Tens) and won $11.90 ($6.20 net)

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Curious why you check turn and raise river. If he shoves over your river raise are you calling?

eNTy said:

This I just lolled at
I'm past tilt woot.
On the other hand being on the right side of set over set is nice too.

3bet is on the small side, but I misscrolled

MP1: $10 (100 bb)
MP2: $15.35 (153.5 bb)
MP3: $6 (60 bb)
CO: $5.50 (55 bb)
Hero (BTN): $15.15 (151.5 bb)
SB: $13.75 (137.5 bb)
BB: $5.40 (54 bb)
UTG+1: $10.30 (103 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is BTN with K

A

MP3 posts BB out of position, 3 folds, MP3 raises to $0.30, CO folds, Hero raises to $0.70, SB calls $0.65, BB folds, MP3 calls $0.40

Flop: ($2.20) 3

2

A

(3 players)
SB bets $0.30, MP3 calls $0.30, Hero raises to $2, SB calls $1.70, MP3 folds

Turn: ($6.50) 5

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($6.50) T

(2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero raises to $3, SB calls $2

Results: $12.50 pot ($0.60 rake)
Hero showed K

A

(a pair of Aces) and lost (-$5.70 net)
SB showed A

T

(two pairs, Aces and Tens) and won $11.90 ($6.20 net)

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maybe its just my HUness coming through, but i always fire this turn, villains range is basically weaker aces/pp's


also rex are you actually training for something?

Edit: yes being ninja'd by zach on a full ring topic makes me feel spshul

Agreed Zach, if you check the turn for pot control, reopening the river makes no sense whatsoever.

Man i could hump this call into submission

--------------------
HAND #1
--------------------

Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 2 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker

Hero (BB): $88.25 (176.5 bb)
SB: $93.50 (187 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is BB with A J
SB raises to $2, Hero raises to $7, SB raises to $16, Hero calls $9

Flop: ($32) 7 A 9 (2 players)
Hero checks, SB bets $18, Hero calls $18

Turn: ($68) 6 (2 players)
Hero checks, SB bets $59.50 and is all-in, Hero calls $54.25 and is all-in

River: ($176.50) 3 (2 players, 2 are all-in)

Results: $176.50 pot ($0.50 rake)
Hero showed A J (a pair of Aces) and won $176 ($87.75 net)
SB mucked 8 7 (a pair of Sevens) and lost (-$88.25 net)



on a proper note. WTF am i meant to do preflop, since im 90% sure villain is 4 betting light (lots of history, and hes proper aggro), so wth am i meant to do? 5 betting obviously clears out his range to polarize his big hands that have me crushed, effectively turning my hand into a bluff.

Does calling and playing oop look fine to you guys since we are deep? even though i have no idea what to do if i miss hte flop and villain is very likely to fire 2 barrels

yea u can call and play OOP. if u don't hit u can still c/r and take maney

switch0723 said:

also rex are you actually training for something?

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Sort of.

Was going to make a post about this at some point and now is as good a time as any.

I'm at a bit of a crossroads with poker. I'm a good MTT player and reckon I can hold my own in most company. Importantly I've lots of ideas where to improve. Specifically end-game if you're interested.

Ring is another matter. I've played a good few 100k hands since starting earlier this year and started at 25nl, 50nl and 100nl at a decent rate (>3BB/100). Ended up moving to 200nl where I started well for a while, but then tailed off to 0.8BB/100 over 75k hands. At this point I decided to follow my advice in the Irexes Principle thread and drop back down.

About this time I realised I had a shot at Supernova, which would be nice. Annoyingly two more months of 200nl and I'd have made it easily, but in some ways setting a target of 1300 hands a day for two months seemed like a good way to get to grips with things at 100nl. What I had come to realise was that I was playing too superficial a game. I'm technically ok, there's nothing horrible about what I was doing and it was winning (albeit not hugely) but I realised I was missing significant monies by not knowing more.

So the Supernova thing is as much about playing a lot of hands and thinking hard about where I go wrong and trying to make some steps forward in my game. I've also joined Stox for the videos and that's helped a lot. I'm a quick learner and have no trouble admitting where I'm wrong so my game is changing fast.

Intention is to clear Supernova (need another 34,000 hands by end of the year) and then spend January consolidating what I've learned, playing fewer tables 4-6 and start to really exploit whatever edge I have.

I've made good money at poker for a few years, but it's been sporadic and anything from 5k-15k due to the joy that is tournies. In 2009 I want to make a steady return from Ring supplemented by some nice boosts from MTTs. As a bonus incentive I'm planning to pay the finance on two cars I bought recently purely through poker. I can afford to pay anyway, but it's a great target and has me focussed properly.

Nothing revelatory but I hope the cusp of something new. It's why I've not updated my blog, cause I was sorting all this out in my head. Did I want to carry on winning small or am I prepared to put in the work to make this something properly profitable?

So expect some blog updates in January (I might post this actually) and a lean-mean-blind-stealing machine to emerge into the new year.